it’s not that I complain on wireless capabilities of mikrotik gear. It’s kind of observation I made. About year ago after I got dissapointed by 802.11ac support from mikrotik I decided to use other producer equipment. The other one that gave me so much enjoyment to work with. But lately I was forced to upgrade some older links, and gave mikrotik one shot more.
Dynadish 802.11ac met my expectations. I was very happy to see nicely working ptp on new software 6.30.4. after few weeks I decided to upgrade other AP, mostly omnitiks. and here we are, what is wrong with… multipoint mode?? It’s a disaster! after day or two it eventually stops passing traffic to clients. neither auto nor 2ms mode helped. Omnitik AP, 12 apc connected, subscribers up to 16mbps, wireless data rate 39-78-90 some with dual polarization even 180mbps.
on the client side speedtest.net shows…3mbps and significant loss of packets. jitter is over reasonable range.
channel under spectral scan is totally clear.
And what, I’ve learned from mikrotik, dont upgrade if You must’nt, so when I was upgrading whole network earlier with new verystableoptimized reouter version I ommited some of omnitiks with 5.14 routeros due to very very long link uptime and very decent throughput. So… I downgraded problematic omnitik to 5.14 firmware issued may 2012, so 3 years old.
Results speed at client 16mbps, total speeed of AP in multipoint mode up to 30 mbps, ping avg 6 ms
3 years back router os had better wireless multipoint nv2 implementation ? where are You heading?
Interesting, I dont have any issues with PTMP with NV2.. but staying away from OmniTik - recently replaced it with UBNT 13dB omni antenna and 711GA, so far no issue and better than OmniTik. It was 3 years old and I am guessing that the antennas or something else started failing… after replacement, all is fine.
The other NV2 PTMP AP I have is based also on UBNT Omni but 912UAG, with 14 MIMO clients (mostly SXTs) I can get up to 50Mb without any issue, selling 30Mb plans.
Staying on 6.19 and 6.21..
So maybe your problem is the OmniTik. Also stay away from combination of MIMO and SISO stations on a MIMO AP
I’m happy that You’ve found solution to the problems, it may be related to poor rf parameters of omnitik in comparison to ubiquiti product. Unfortunately 6.19 or 6.21 firmware if works better than 6.30 then this may mean that newer routeros releases are getting worse each time. My example was to get clear picture of software problem. ofcourse better antenna will do much, but if simply staying on 5.14 solves the problem then something looks not ok, ok?
New releases bring stability in exchange for losing random bursts of speed. Nv2 is much more stable and reliable now. It is possible that you have some specific conditions where you see lower speed “on the surface” but your link is more reliable than before and has less errors and disconnections.
yes. pretty nothing new to hear from You Mr.Normis. frankly speaking I haven’t expected anything else. as usual.
Ok I stick with older routeros and wait another year maybe some mikrotik equipment will stand. As for now
reverting to 3 years old routeros gives me 4xtimes faster result at client and stable jitter.
and stability You say, after small checkup in my network AP with 5.18 have uptime 262days, apc 2 weeks uninterrupted link. so what was You talking about stability ??
one more thing, could I use 6.30.4 routeros with 5.18 wireless package?
I can only say what is fact. Developers are not making changes for fun and games. They do actual work and work very hard. I know what they work on, so I can give you honest answer.
On the other post i make a lot of test last 2 week and the only thing i can point on is latency and tcp window scaling…
im not a specialist and maybe im wrong but all my test point to this. check the other post for my test.
Plz MKT i know you work hard and its very difficult to please everybody(impossible) is the war between throughput and latency…(People like me love latency but the normal client just see throughput…)
We’ve been offering similar complaints to Mikrotik (face to face at MUM in NZ as well); and will STILL have an unresolved ticket that must be coming up 6 months old re: wireless performance and 4xx series board having issues with NV2 / Nstreme in 6.2x.x and we just get ye old “try the latest version” without any explanation and which STILL yields no improvement.
We have seen some improvement and good results out of 9xx series APs/CPE; but that doesn’t really help us when we have several thousand 4 and 7 series boards out there that are wirelessly unstable on the latest versions of ROS (above 6.20); and Mikrotik appear to be making zero effort to work with us to resolve.
Long long long story short; we’ve been looking at switching to Cambium - even their ePMP equipment, at the very least does exactly what it says it will; and more importantly their support people are happy to be responsive and helpful.
FWIW its Ticket#2015021966000088
Its a shame; we love(d) mikrotik but it appears other vendors are now catching up / overtaking and even at Mikrotiks price point.
I have submitted a few tickets with the problems of NV2. The most recent was replied with “We are aware of the problems but we are fixing 802.11 first” I actually moved all of my point to point ac links to 802.11 (Can you even imagine it) and i was surprised to see that my throughput on tcp traffic doubled. My packet loss stopped and I no longer saw the incremental speed decrease i was seeing over multiple nv2 hops. Now my Multipoint Network is still NV2. It is stable enough to handle VOIP and decent Internet however. My customers that have VPN’s are constantly complaining that they keep dropping the VPN connection. I am actually thinking of trying out 802.11 for multipoint as well (I know I know). NV2 is a great IDEA but it is a long way from a good working solution. I am also very sure that the Mikrotik Programers are working very hard. HOWEVER, I would make this suggestion. Instead of constantly adding new features. Stabilize what you have already released so it is usable by the people that are buying it for those advertised uses. Two philosophies I find are being more and more dismissed.
KISS it (Keep is simple stupid) - the more you Gum it up. the easier it is to break
Jack of all trades, Master of none. - You can’t be all things to everyone but you can be the absolute best at a few things.
If i was Mikrotik I would ask my self these questions.
Is the base that made my company successful being served?
answer: No, Other companies has surpassed your stability and met your price point.
How do we Maintain our edge?
answer : Look at you company focus. and possibly split your development track of ROS into two branches.
Consumer/SOHO/wifi branch - Focusing on new features and individual user experience
Carrier Branch - Focusing on Carrier related technologies. I.E. Fixing NV2 or making a better system. Fixing multi-core utilization with CCR.
It is a nice idea that one software will do it all. But the reality is. Consumer and SOHO operations require very different solutions then Carrier (wisp, ISP, etc.) operations do.
Please don’t let ubiquity make Mikrotik absolute. I have allot of money in my Mikrotik network. (But I am starting to lose customers because of problems that are NEVER addressed in NV2).
Overall NV2 is very stable and yes its far from perfect, I have found NV2 to be more stable in noisy environments than 802.11, with Mikrotik as everything is done in software, CPU is king as faster CPU speed gives better performance?
I remove any packages not required and in a lot of cases default setting in wireless does not give me the best performance, so I adjust a lot of settings, in a nutshell you have to tweak like hell to get the best from Mikrotik and
in reality problems encountered by us can only be solved by us and some are under illusion that all issues can be solved by just getting better software, I think there should be special builds for different components ,
like PTP, AP, Routers, switches, etc as “One size does fit everyone perfectly”
I do agree that tweaking is needed to get the most out of Mikrotik. I can not disagree more on a one size fits all perfectly. What you are telling me is a ISP with 2000 users should operated the same as a local wifi network. That is juvenile at best and as a forum guru i am highly disappointed in your reply. That is like saying that a linksys router works just as well as an enterprise cisco router. IT is simply untrue. In addition you don’t see linksys (when owned by cisco) Run the SAME os as their enterprise routers.
The lack of understanding is starting to become obscene. When customers come to this forum with recommendations or requests. It is done as a loyal customer base trying to communicate with the company they do business with and Spend money on. The fact that all you ever get back is in just tweak it better is mind boggling. So Mr. n21Roadie Tell me how do you tweak NV2 to stop inherent packet loss and low TCP throughput when all you can adjust is frame size. Please put some examples and facts behind your statements. I have 3 different trouble tickets with full test results and configs on each system to Mikrotik with the reply that THEY KNOW THERE IS A PROBLEM. They just refuse to fix it.
I omitted to add in my comment which should have read, “One size does NOT fit everyone perfectly” sorry?
to repeat I found NV2 to be more stable than 802.11 but a long way from being perfect as everyone knows here,
I am also a WISP and have had to solve my own issues, we cannot expect Mikrotik or any other supplier to solve our problems, why not - simply the issues are in most cases complicated with local and distant issues triggering some,
It never ceases to amaze me when users think better software will solve all wireless issues, OK a particular build may suppress a issue for a while but does not solve it,
And in my opinion there is no supplier who can deliver wireless equipment “off the shelf” that is doesn’t have operational shortcomings?
I like many others have setup a test network for testing new software before applying to the complete network and have spent a lot of time checking suggestions by other users and some were very good and others not so good, this is where I have got my tweaks that work for me, unfortunately there is no short cuts in getting the best or stabilizing a wireless network,
The first question I would be asking is what causes dropped packets with the equipment you have and how will i know if another supplier equipment will not have similar problems, no doubt some users will reply back saying brand x is great and then later you read others having a different type of issue with brand x
In my opinion there is a major fundamental operational issue with radio cards when they switch between TX and RX,
and this applies to all suppliers
You can argue for a while. We’ve end of 2015 and development goes on. Just tested a competitors gear and can’t no longer argue to stay with nv2. I talked to MT. I talked in this forum that something has to be done. They developed hex and whatsoever but nobody cares. May be their decisions are appropriate for MT and they sell more home routers than cpes. So I have to shop elsewhere.
I agree. I am tired of arguing as well. I actually moved parts of my network over to 802.11 last night. I actually got calls from customers telling me their service seamed allot better today then it has over the last few months. More telling is the call i got from one of my financial institutes that said their VPN has not dropped connection all day. (a first for them in over 9 months). Coincidence that this happens immediately after i move off of NV2 to (God forbid) 802.11. We have also tested Cambium and Ubiquity and find that they are (sorry to say) superior to Mikrotik on the Multipoint systems. I also believe MT focus has shifted from that of being a supplier to wisp’s to that of consumers. It if is the right call for them that is fine. I still like their cloud core product line but sad to say unless something changes soon on the NV2 front I am going to have to start the migration to a different radio system.
No doubt if Mikrotik does not improve or at least keep up others on the wireless front we will all be forced to change,
Also the benefits will not be using 802.11 but another propriety TDMA wireless protocol and we know what that means,
Another thought is that while the addition of new AP’s of a new brand will be fast the changeover of CPE’s cannot happen overnight, but will Mikrotik and the other brand equipment co-exist on the same mast or will it be like hell for lot of customers until the swap out is completed, this will result in the loss of customers and we cannot expect to get the benefits of say gps sync until non gps equipment is removed?
