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timberwolf
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:27 pm


So, your saying MR in general on all platforms including PPC platform?
And you're not agree on the statement? :
http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... 11#p301963
Tweaking your configuration until the system runs stable isn't a solution.
At best that's a workarround and nothing you let your customers play with.
Do you have any experience of ROS x86 KVM stability?
No. I would like to think that this configuration might be usable, but I am unwilling to take the risk.

I'm starting to suspect that whoever wrote the MR code isn't longer working for MikroTik. So MR might be considered an abandoned technology.
 
peson
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:16 pm

Tweaking your configuration until the system runs stable isn't a solution.
At best that's a workarround and nothing you let your customers play with.
Totally agree on this.
As long there aren't any description and manuals provided with confirmed and tested configurations, the MR aren't usefull.
No. I would like to think that this configuration might be usable, but I am unwilling to take the risk.
I will setup an x86 appliance for heavy tests the KVM.
I'm going to test it exactly same way as I'm testing the MR
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:22 am

good, waiting for your results.
 
peson
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 08, 2012 5:50 pm

good, waiting for your results.
Some results, or to be more precise, different config settings between MetaROUTER and KVM.
Janis! correct me if I'm wrong about my assumptions and conclusions.

I'm trying to understand the different configurations based on my Linux knowledge and how-to configuring tun/tap, vlan and bridges in Linux OS.
When creating static interfaces in MetaROUTER, you can select physical interfaces like Ether1.
The selection list on KVM show only the interfaces already added as Virtual Ethernet interfaces. (/interface virtual-ethernet)

In MR, if I use a physical (not configured on the host) interface in a guest and add VLAN on that interface on the guest, the VLANs works.

To do the same thing in KVM I need to create a bridge with a tap interface and the physical interface I want to bind it to.
The tap interface is the interface that is attached to the guest.

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.
I have arp in the guest and the bridge host table looks alright, but the guest is not responding.
The difference between the configuration of virtual ethernet interfaces, is that in KVM you can assign MAC-address on both host and guest side, but not in MR.
If I, in MR, change from static to dynamic and assign the interface to the same bridge it all starts working again. And now, it assigns a MAC-address on the host side.

From Winbox (2.2.18) I can add and view Virtual Ethernet interfaces in KVM, but not in MR.

Is the MetaROUTER paravirtualization or just a software on the hosts that emulates a ROS?

More to come.....
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:00 am

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.

this one is interesting, now if you could give full configuration of the "same" configuration would be nice (to avoid confusions. That is mipsbe router?)

when you assign physical interface to MR tap interface is tapped into the physical interface well before a lot of stuff that works with packets in RouterOS. There are some services that can get packets on the host from that interface, but could not work around that. In KVM that is not possible. When transmit happens from MR packets are put into interface send buffer and interface just sends them out (as it usually does, as interface only concern is OSI Layer1)

MetaROUTER is not just ROS emulation, as it is possible to have OpenWRT and, as some reports say, debian running as guests. Similar to KVM, MR requires CPU virtualization support.

RouterBOARD routers will not have Virtual Ethernet tab, instead use filtering to filter out virtual interfaces if you have a lot of interfaces on the router.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:21 am

the frequency of reboots of the board is not connected to PSU in any way, of course, board has to have enough resources. It was tested at full CPU load.
Maybe ... However, with a 12 volt transformer PSU 450G uptime for over 5 days. However, I did not banished tests this time, but with a 24 volt PSU uptime does not exceed several hours even under no load.
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:11 am

i have ability to set PSU voltage to value i desire in range where RB450G is working and change of that did not change stability of the setup. Maybe you could list what amperage you get at what voltage from these PSUs?

edit: check in what condition are your capacitors.
 
barkas
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:10 pm

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.

this one is interesting, now if you could give full configuration of the "same" configuration would be nice (to avoid confusions. That is mipsbe router?)

when you assign physical interface to MR tap interface is tapped into the physical interface well before a lot of stuff that works with packets in RouterOS. There are some services that can get packets on the host from that interface, but could not work around that. In KVM that is not possible. When transmit happens from MR packets are put into interface send buffer and interface just sends them out (as it usually does, as interface only concern is OSI Layer1)

MetaROUTER is not just ROS emulation, as it is possible to have OpenWRT and, as some reports say, debian running as guests. Similar to KVM, MR requires CPU virtualization support.

RouterBOARD routers will not have Virtual Ethernet tab, instead use filtering to filter out virtual interfaces if you have a lot of interfaces on the router.
OpenWRT is heavily patched to run on MetaRouter. I seriously doubt you can get anything to run without heavy modifications, e.g. full paravirtualization.

Are you sure MetaRouter does hardware virtualization on MIPS?
 
timberwolf
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:15 pm

I wonder, if by any chance, one of the MetaRouter developers could chime in here and contribute something usefull or at least interesting...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:28 pm

janisk

Transformer PSU used DVE DV-1250UP 12V/0.5A
450G when operating this PSU at idle consumes 0.36A with running Metarouter and 0.31A with a stopped Metarouter

The problem with the electrolitic capacitors Suxxon me know :) see here and here. These capacitors from the main DC/DC converter (7...28V to 3.3V) were replaced in advance by electrolitic Nichicon 1000.0/6.3V, combined with a faulty motherboard. The input capacitor 330.0/35V I have not replaced, he works in a relatively comfortable conditions.

In the plans to test the stability of pulsed PSU Powertron PA1008-2DE 12V/0.5A. And how will his free time, to measure the waveform at several control points on the power rails. It also plans after checking power supplies want to replace electrolytic capacitors with polymeric and verify with the standard 24V PSU.

p.s. There is also a possibility that could fail PoE switch logic, such as short-term switch, which is why just lost power. Unfortunately, I have no design scheme to say this objectively.
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:52 am

I wonder, if by any chance, one of the MetaRouter developers could chime in here and contribute something usefull or at least interesting...
all questions are delivered to MetaROUTER devs
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:15 am

So will this ever be fixed at all?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:12 am

Stability test with a pulse PSU Powertron PA1008-2DE 12V/0.5A is successful. RB450G uptime 5 days.
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:59 am

with all links active and with CPU loaded 0.5A @12V can be too short. You could be lucky with any other PSU. But good to hear that you have it running for 5 days now.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:46 pm

No, only four active link and a regular on an Internet surfing. But even in this mode with 24V PSU uptime does not exceed several hours.
"Native" 24V PSU tried two things - with both equally unstable.
p.s. It is still checking PSU. Ahead - a study with an oscilloscope. ))
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:43 pm

No, only four active link and a regular on an Internet surfing. But even in this mode with 24V PSU uptime does not exceed several hours.
"Native" 24V PSU tried two things - with both equally unstable.
p.s. It is still checking PSU. Ahead - a study with an oscilloscope. ))

Really, oscilloscope? End result. The feature seems to just not work.
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:17 pm

or id having just system and security packages it works for very long times (sometimes)
 
Begetan
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:10 am

Today I began to test Metarouter on RB493G platform, ROS5.12

I'm runing defult configuration on host router and two MR - one with ROS 5.12, the other with DDWRT images from this manual http://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:Metarouter.

Every router has one static and one dynamic port. Thats all.
I'v got 3 crashes ( with systems reboot) with interval from 15 to 90 minutes.
I see that RB45x and RB49x devices not sutable for MR feature about 3 years :shock:

Could anybody answere below question?

1. Does this problem deal with only DDWRT or ROS Virtual machine too?
2. How it works on PPC architecture?
3. What device is the most stable for runing MR wit ROS Image? How long uptime they have?
 
peson
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:22 pm


1. Does this problem deal with only DDWRT or ROS Virtual machine too?
2. How it works on PPC architecture?
3. What device is the most stable for runing MR wit ROS Image? How long uptime they have?
As you can read from my previous posts, the MR aren't useful in any platform.
If you want virtualization in ROS, go for x86 platform and run KVM (Qemu) guests.

/Paul
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:48 pm

Did this ever get solved? Or all is lost?
 
timberwolf
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:12 pm

MT claims to be close to a fix, have a look here: http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=60746
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:07 am

Doesn't look like it to me..

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