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QpoX
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:44 pm

it should fix rebooting router problem, at least my test routers have not rebooted after installing version with patches. Sadly other problems in that build prevent me for giving out some pre-release versions.
Just as long that the GPS problem is fixed (as i was promised since 4.1) edontcare about anything else :)
But is it possible to get a pre version that has the GPS fixed?
Since i've been without a internal NTP server for over 2 month's now...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:46 pm

there were other more serious issues in pre-releases. we are testing newer builds now, but those are not ready to be given out.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 10:47 am

I upgrated my test 450G to RoS 4.4, but problem with rebooting with enabled OpenWRT in Metaroter not fixed.
My RB450G rebooted after 20 minutes. I can sent supout file.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 11:46 am

in log - rebooted by watchdog timer?

none of test routers hanged for me at least. and are up and running since patched version was built.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 12:14 pm

Yes. In log present next:
[nik@mt-test] > log print
jan/01/2002 03:00:04 system,error,critical router was rebooted without proper shutdown by watchdog timer

What does it mean - "patched version"?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 12:15 pm

he means v4.4 that is on the web. maybe you have some other issue now? contact support
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 1:42 pm

I disabled watchdog timer and RB450G (RoS 4.4) stop rebooting, but sometimes RB450G freezes and stop ANY network activity. I will contact support.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 21, 2009 6:34 pm

Running openwrt r17779, w/ 4.4 firmware on RB450G...rebooted itself in 17 minutes... :(
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Dec 23, 2009 9:31 am

what are you doing in those metarouter guests?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:35 pm

Not doing anything at all. Now I disabled VM in Metarouter.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Dec 28, 2009 2:07 am

I just run some kind of tests on a brand new 450g with ROS 4.4 and openwrt in metarouter and I thought, the results could be helpful.

I tried different openwrt image versions with no difference.
In every case the watchdog rebooted the system in under 2h uptime.
When I disabled the watchdog however, the system ran 20h straight, until I aborted the test.
While running without watchdog, the system seemed to hang for about 30 - 60 seconds from time to time.
While in the "hanging" state, the system did not answer ICMP packets (RouterOS or OpenWRT) and also did not react to key presses on the serial console.
After the said time of up to 60 seconds, the system ran normally, but nagios (running inside the OpenWRT/Metarouter) showed extremly high cpu usage.

Regards,
bkb

Edit: Checked out r16424 of OpenWrt and built it, because it is the same Version your image in the Wiki is, but the packets on openwrt.org are missing, so anyways...
I built r16424 and tried that, with watchdog and ROS 4.4.
I installed all my packets which I had on the newer OpenWrt Version (see above).
I have 8h of uptime and going, so that looks quite good!
I will abort the test when I reached 24h uptime without watchdog-reboot and tell you about that.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:56 am

if you can, run test for several days, because some times it took more than that to reproduce the problem. At least one i could reproduce.

Also, if possible remove all additional configuration/packages that are installed on the router (best case, leave just system package) and see if problem manifests it self.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Dec 31, 2009 10:03 pm

ok, unfortunately the system rebooted after about 20h of uptime and then pretty regularly about every 2 hours.
I really thought, that using the older version of OpenWrt would turn out to make a difference.

I am hoping that the there will be a fix for that problem...

- bkb
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sun Jan 03, 2010 8:38 pm

I am experiencing similar issues, I have tried the following, all with the same sporadic crashes:

* RouterBoards: RB450G, RB411U, RB433UAH
* RouterOS versions: v4.2, v4.3, v4.4
* Only installed System package, also tried with only System & Routerboard packages
* OpenWRT builds: Official from the wiki, I also built R18199
* default OpenWRT config as well as several variations stripping out as much extra funtionality as I could, removed all kernel modules, extra packages
* 12v, 24, 48v PSU's with and without poe
* disabled/enabled watchdog

It seems the OpenWRT VM crashes without anything consistant in the logs, like the virtual hardware is locking up entirely at random. If the vm is left entirely idle it seems to increase the stability, got 2 days uptime in one case, but as soon as there's activity (network traffic, shell access) it doesn't stay up for longer than a few hours, often hanging every few minutes.

Please let me know if you need any further information/testing on this. I'm eager to get a stable OpenWRT VM running.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jan 04, 2010 12:46 am

Just noticed that it seems the VM's lockup is not permanent. Instead of disaling and enabling the metarouter, I just left it in it's frozen state and it reanimated some time later(not sure how long, I was away from my pc for a few hours).

The first message was:

Bus error

Hope this helps...
 
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congo
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jan 04, 2010 12:40 pm

While in the "hanging" state, the system did not answer ICMP packets (RouterOS or OpenWRT) and also did not react to key presses on the serial console.
After the said time of up to 60 seconds, the system ran normally, but nagios (running inside the OpenWRT/Metarouter) showed extremly high cpu usage.
I have the same problem with OpenWRT in RB450G MetaRouter on v4.4 (upgraded from v3.28 which also had the issue). I noticed the high CPU load inside the OpenWRT from the system load then logging in after the hang.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jan 05, 2010 11:48 pm

Up for 20 days with my 450G and 3.30 RouterOS.

uptime: 2w6d5h33m11s
version: "3.30"
free-memory: 186524kB
total-memory: 257364kB

Inside metarouter

root@xxxxxxxx/# uptime
18:48:09 up 19 days, 23:58, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:03 am

Hi, can you public your metarouter image ?
Up for 20 days with my 450G and 3.30 RouterOS.

uptime: 2w6d5h33m11s
version: "3.30"
free-memory: 186524kB
total-memory: 257364kB

Inside metarouter

root@xxxxxxxx/# uptime
18:48:09 up 19 days, 23:58, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:09 am

Hi,
can you public your metarouter image ?
Thank
Up for 20 days with my 450G and 3.30 RouterOS.

uptime: 2w6d5h33m11s
version: "3.30"
free-memory: 186524kB
total-memory: 257364kB

Inside metarouter

root@xxxxxxxx/# uptime
18:48:09 up 19 days, 23:58, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
 
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congo
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:40 am

Up for 20 days with my 450G and 3.30 RouterOS.

uptime: 2w6d5h33m11s
version: "3.30"
free-memory: 186524kB
total-memory: 257364kB

Inside metarouter

root@xxxxxxxx/# uptime
18:48:09 up 19 days, 23:58, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
I have just downgraded from 4.4 to 3.30 to check, but the issue remains. It is not about the uptime, but every few minutes both the RouterOS and the OpenWRT will go to "sleep". Does not reboot (at least not very often...).
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 11:11 am

older version that 4.4 will have other bug that was fixed when you router just crashed and was rebooted by watchdog timer.

I am not clear how to induce that state of freezing reliably, all i have now is sit and wait. Also, on router that freezes from time to time - try to put it under load, make it do something in host, and see if it still freezes from time to time. (Run like bandwidth-test to itself).
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:16 pm

older version that 4.4 will have other bug that was fixed when you router just crashed and was rebooted by watchdog timer.
It's back on 4.4 now. This is just a test box serving my IP phones, so I can test any version.
I am not clear how to induce that state of freezing reliably, all i have now is sit and wait. Also, on router that freezes from time to time - try to put it under load, make it do something in host, and see if it still freezes from time to time. (Run like bandwidth-test to itself).
If you wish, I can provide you with the info how I configured this board, even give remote access to it if that helps. Just started a bbandwidth test to localhost, will write if it helps.

EDIT: It did not help. Just this time it was not freezing for minutes, but rebooting. The logs show:
jan/02/1970 01:00:19 system,error,critical System rebooted because of kernel failure
jan/02/1970 01:00:19 system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:43 pm

well, first bug did hang board completely, so only chance was to reboot the router (power-cycle it if watchdog timer was disabled) second bug i am trying to reveal in details - will not hang your router completely, but it will freeze it for some time and then router will continue to work. that is, as far as i have tested and seen results.

also, limit BT to some values making cpu load above 50 but below 70 or 80 percent.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:47 pm

also, limit BT to some values making cpu load above 50 but below 70 or 80 percent.
Today btest was running for about an hour (~60% CPU), it did not hang during that. But after the Winbox session failed (maybe some network problem) and btest stopped, it hang again. Also it did not fail yet during a call was made through the Asterisk running in OpenWRT - or maybe I was lucky every time. I will try this with a long test call and report back.

EDIT: Is it possible, that there is no "complete hang", so router only hangs for a few minutes, but people are not patient enough and restart?

EDIT 2: After more than 1 hours of the test call, Winbox session and SSH to the OpenWRT failed, and the phone went deaf, but after a few minutes came back. Maybe in the case of the btest, the winbox failed because of a hang?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:26 pm


EDIT: It did not help. Just this time it was not freezing for minutes, but rebooting. The logs show:
jan/02/1970 01:00:19 system,error,critical System rebooted because of kernel failure
jan/02/1970 01:00:19 system,error,critical router rebooted without proper shutdown, probably power outage
I get identical log messages when running both guest and host under load. uptime varies between a few hours and a few minutes.

RB411U
ROS v4.4
OpenWRT r18199
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:18 am

Any updates from Mikrotik on the status of this bug?

I submitted a support request (as suggested in this thread ) over a week a ago without any response.

Would be nice to know whether it's being worked on and if so whether a fix might be included in the next update.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jan 12, 2010 9:55 am

It is worked on, if it where no, i would not have asked for support files.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:57 am

Hi!

Is there any update on this issue?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:04 pm

I second that question. It has been two months since last response. Firmware 4.6 has come out, but nothing in changelog about this issue. This forum post has been very quiet too. Is this issue still being worked on?

Thanks.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:34 pm

could anyone check if that problems you have on RB450G also occur on RB433AH.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Mar 26, 2010 5:39 pm

We tested the 433AH in our lab yesterday using 24VDC. It has rebooted at least once since yesterday. So far uptime is 23 hours.

I have also used 12VDC on the 433AH. When running 12VDC the 433AH reboots about once every 3 to 4 days.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:26 am

you where running OpenWRT in metarouter. What interface type you use, as in, dynamic, static or static physical?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Mar 29, 2010 4:15 pm

The interface type is dynamic on both RB433AH and RB450G.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:46 pm

Today I upgraded my RB450G to v4.7 because of the MetaROUTER fix mentioned in the changelog. Interestingly 4.7 for RB4xx is not available for me on the web, but I changed the version number in the URL of 4.6, and it worked. (One mirror served a corrupted file with the correct size so I had to download it twice.)

The frequent lockups went away, so after running fine for a few hours, I turned watchdog back on (which was disabled as per a request from support). Sadly, another few hours later the router rebooted itself again, and the log says watchdog timer. Also, with nearly all the reboots, the few last recently edited configuration files in the OpenWRT metarouter are truncated to zero-length.

I opened a ticket with support, and am waiting for a response. Also turned off watchdog, and hoping for the best...

ps. My interface type is also dynamic.

Update: The hangs continue, just they appear every few hours instead of every few minutes. This issue has probably not been fixed.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue May 04, 2010 2:52 am

I believe this is the exact issue I am experiencing on 5.0 Beta 2. It got ALOT worse on 5.0 B2. I had hardly noticed it on 4.6-4.9 but on 5.0B2 it fails at most in 1 hour or less.. With the watchdog turned off it hangs the router but does recover by itself after some period of time.

This is on a 450G. My power supply is doing 14.6Vdc and has 3 amps available.

Im using a Mikrotik image for the meta router.

I have a thread on this at http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... 2&p=206394 and have sent support requests.

My watchdog timer does not generate autosup for these events..
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue May 04, 2010 10:51 am

Running 4.9 now. I added a Netwatch to the metarouter guest. Funny.

may/03 22:22:40 system,info monitoring new host by admin
may/03 22:22:41 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
may/03 22:23:26 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
may/03 22:28:42 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
may/03 22:34:20 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
may/03 22:36:40 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
may/03 22:41:18 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
may/03 22:48:40 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
may/03 22:53:16 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
may/03 22:58:07 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
00:13:06 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
00:22:48 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
01:02:44 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
01:06:32 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
01:39:14 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
01:43:02 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
02:26:36 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
02:34:36 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
02:38:38 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
02:41:48 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
03:16:00 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
03:24:14 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
03:34:04 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
03:36:36 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
03:42:45 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
03:46:58 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.
04:03:36 script,info OpenWRT guest is down.
04:15:50 script,info OpenWRT guest is up.

I opened another ticket on 24. apr. regarding this issue. Still no reply...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:47 pm

Had a weird one today. During the night, the metarouter on one of our Tiks seems to have deleted itself...apparently after one of the watchdog reboots. This is only a theory because this is CPE equipment that one of our resellers sold to a customer. So, anything is possible :) This is the first time I have seen this.

Anybody else see this behavior?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jun 16, 2010 4:29 am

I have hesitated to ask, but is there any update for this issue?

Either way, would it be too much to ask for weekly or monthly updates?

It has been quite a while since anyone from MT posted a status.....
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Jul 01, 2010 6:05 pm

I believe this is the exact issue I am experiencing on 5.0 Beta 2. It got ALOT worse on 5.0 B2. I had hardly noticed it on 4.6-4.9 but on 5.0B2 it fails at most in 1 hour or less.. With the watchdog turned off it hangs the router but does recover by itself after some period of time.

This is on a 450G. My power supply is doing 14.6Vdc and has 3 amps available.

Im using a Mikrotik image for the meta router.

I have a thread on this at http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... 2&p=206394 and have sent support requests.

My watchdog timer does not generate autosup for these events..

I read your post and it was really good troubleshooting. Way to dig in there :) I see in that post that when you disabled NTP on 5.0B2 you were satisfied that MR and ROS were running fine. Is this still the case? I was previously running 4.5 with same reboot issues. I tried to disable all un-used ROS packages, clean up openWRT (disable all daemons I wasn't using) and disable ROS NTP. Reboot issues remain. I see from the changelogs that there was mention of a metarouter fix in 4.7.

So, now I'm doing the same sort of test (although not as detailed as your previous tests) with ROS 4.10 and OpenWRT MR. ROS 4.10, all unused ROS packages disabled, openwrt cleaned up and NTP disabled. Just began test yesterday. Results aren't ready yet. Testing on 2 routers in production and 1 in the lab. 2-RB433AH (24v) and 1-RB450G (12v). Incidentally, the 433AHs are a little more stable, but if they have enough load from users I've seen them reboot quite often (upwards of 5 times per day). Even w/o load they still reboot a couple times per week.

Another thing I am considering trying is to re-compile with the OpenWRT MR 1.2 patch. I am currently using an image I compiled with the 1.1 patch. Not sure if that will make any difference.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:27 pm

Well, 4.10 and OpenWRT in the configuration above was a little more stable. Previously on the 2 production routers, I was getting 1-2 days uptime. Now, I get 4-5 days uptime. So, I think it's an improvement. There seemed to be no difference in my configuration whether NTP was enabled or not.

What I did notice on a different router at a really busy site with the same config was that when the CPU is already really busy about 30-40% and MR is placed on top of it, the CPU gets pegged out to 100% and stays there. After about 10-15 minutes the router reboots via watchdog. That particular test was on a 433AH board running 24vdc. Had to disable MR at that location. I think it would be nice to be able to tell metarouter that you want it to only consume a specific percentage of CPU resources. This way, metarouter would not take too many cpu resources.

Has anybody recompiled OpenWRT with the new 1.2 patch? Is it any better? Wondering if I should give that a try next.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Aug 26, 2010 6:32 am

I have a lot of Metarouters in production, all running a 2nd routerOS on 450g's. We have stopped putting them in production and have started to replace some of them with other solutions because of these problems.

I have tried assigning different amounts of memory to the metarouter, tried different power supplies, tried different routerOS versions (currently running 4.10). Still these continue to reboot themselves. Version 4.9 and 4.10 do seem more stable than previous versions as they seem to reboot themselves instead of needing manual power cycles. If I disable watchdog, they lock up.

Mikrotik, any update?

Thanks!
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Aug 26, 2010 10:15 pm

Also, have tried:
- different firmware versions, currently running version 2.26.
- turning off NTP client (on both virtual and physical routers)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:42 am

I have been waiting for this issue to be resolved and have had to give up and move on.

But, I do have this to add:
Is this problem directly related to time keeping by the metarouter?

The reason I suggest this is I had a very similar problem with a vmware machine. The virtual servers would occasionally and randomly peg the cpu. During this time, no traffic would pass. The only cure was a virtual machine reset.

What I found was that time was not being kept, and in fact, time would sometimes move backwards as least as reported by `date`. These machines did not have the proper ntp settings as recommended by vmware.

In particular, I have found that only the vmware.pool.ntp.org servers are reliable and 'tinker panic 0' is required in ntp.conf.
If I move away from the vmware.pool.ntp.org servers in about 2 weeks time I get a lockup.
vmware states that large time errors can be expected and ntp would typically choke on such a large error if 'tinker panic 0' is not set.

Does this problem only occur with openwrt images or also mikrotik metarouters?

If the answer to that is 'yes' than what is different about time keeping of the 2 metarouters?

With all that being said, is it possible this or something similar could be the problem?

I would truly like to see a reliable OpenWRT metarouter for the 450G.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 06, 2010 9:58 am

that happens with both OpenWRT and RouterOS virtual routers. And it sometimes happens with timekeeping turned off, and with timekeeping turned on.

If talk about virtualized RouterOS, then most stable results are if you keep installed packages to the minimum (like system package only)
 
pkelly1603
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 07, 2010 5:56 pm

Is there a fix in the works for this?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Nov 03, 2010 5:40 am

Word is v5 firmware will fix. However, I haven't had a chance to test it yet.
 
pkelly1603
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:13 am

I have an RB450g that has been running on 5.0rc7, 2.29 firmware for a few weeks. Same problem :(


MMM MMM KKK TTTTTTTTTTT KKK
MMMM MMMM KKK TTTTTTTTTTT KKK
MMM MMMM MMM III KKK KKK RRRRRR OOOOOO TTT III KKK KKK
MMM MM MMM III KKKKK RRR RRR OOO OOO TTT III KKKKK
MMM MMM III KKK KKK RRRRRR OOO OOO TTT III KKK KKK
MMM MMM III KKK KKK RRR RRR OOOOOO TTT III KKK KKK

MikroTik RouterOS 5.0rc7 (c) 1999-2010 http://www.mikrotik.com/



(324 messages not shown)
jan/01/1970 18:00:25 system,error,critical router was rebooted without proper shut
d
by watchdog timer

jan/01/1970 18:00:25 system,error,critical router was rebooted without proper shut
d
own by watchdog timer
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Jan 21, 2011 6:02 pm

Bummer :(
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:36 pm

Still no news? An update about what progress (if any) is being made would be nice.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:38 pm

Hi all,
I need to run a web server on an RB450G to allow a quick web configuration wizard for the routerboard.

In the past I did the job by using a java setup wizard application. Now I have migrated the code to PHP and I have put it "in the hands" of lighttpd under OpenWRT.

Everything works almost fine but the stability, and, indeed, the routerboard reboots (and/or crashes) very often.

I did a lot of tests with no success.

By reading this thread I realized that the issues I experienced could be related to some kind of bug (power supply???) rather than a RouterOS or an OpenWRT misconfiguration.

Is there someone who has solved this issue? No one has finally cutted the "Gordian Knot"?

My configuration is:
  • - Roterboard model: RB450G
  • - Operating System: routerOS 5.0rc11
  • - OpenWRT: KAMIKAZE (bleeding edge, r25398) with lighttpd (1.4.28) and php (5.3.4) (
Thank you in advance.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:39 am

remove all the unnecessary packages can bring down the crash numbers a lot. Just think what packages you need and ones you can do without. And it is not PSU related, it just requires good one, as any other device.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:42 pm

Thank you Janisk for your kind reply.
remove all the unnecessary packages can bring down the crash numbers a lot. Just think what packages you need and ones you can do without.
Do you mean the unnecessary packages in RouterOS, in OpenWRT or both?

Do you know if someone already solved the "reboot issues" by removing these unnecessary packages?
And it is not PSU related, it just requires good one, as any other device.
I normally use the TW-AC24-10 Power Supply 24V 1.0A EU.
Of course, if I deactivate the metarouter the RB is really stable.

Anyway, I would like to better understand what exactly arises the reboot issue...memory leak? cpu load? resource access collison?

Any suggestion about the amount of memory to allocate for OpenWRT metarouter? I did several tests allocating memory in the range 32-128MB. I experienced some issue by using 128MB because of the router had not enough memory to run properly.

Thanks again.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Mar 11, 2011 3:16 pm

as my tests show - then uptime increases.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:00 pm

I gave up, and stopped using MetaRouter for anything. It is interesting though, that some people in this forum still recommend running stuff in MetaRouter for production use.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:55 am

if i have metarouter with uptime of more than 2 weeks, and only reason why it is not higher is version updates. Then why not?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:11 pm

Unfortunately, not everyone is so lucky. Allow me to sum up my frustration with metarouter.

About two months ago I received request for recursive DNS resolver with DNSSEC validation. MikroTik is clearly not going to provide anything like that in near future, if ever. No problem, OpenWRT with Unbound running as MR would be perfect solution.
As I was new to MR and not expecting any problems, I started with installed ROS 4.5 or so (at RB450G). Router didn't stay alive for long enough to even allow me to finish the configuration. I upgraded to latest and greatest stable ROS at the time (4.16), but nothing changed. I went through forum and found this thread. Oh well, just my luck that I must get the only model that does not work well, I thought. So the resolver went to other computer that was fortunately also running 24/7.

Another case where MR would be useful came up yesterday. This time with brand new RB493G and ROS 4.17 (I understood that it was mostly RB450G with problems, so why not). And really, it was much better. Except for one strange MR lockup at the beginning (I pretended that I didn't see it), it appeared stable. There were no other problems for the whole time I was playing with it (around three hours). Then I left it running. Today I connected to host router again and oops, there was reboot by watchdog timer in the log. I talked to colleague who was sitting near the router and he said it was beeping (= rebooting) the whole day. Great. So I upgraded ROS to 5.0rc11, just to lose all hope, when first reboot came two minutes after starting MR. The only difference is that instead of "watchdog timer" the reason is now called "cause 1". The router is going to production use tomorrow, without MR of course. I don't have the nerve to explain to customer, that everything under fifty reboots a day is ok. ;)

In both cases the routers were basically idling. Just doing the role of NAT router for three users and 4 Mbits in first case. And completely nothing in second. Installed packages were near the bare minimum (advanced-tools, dhcp, ipv6, ppp, routerboard, security and system). I could probably get rid of advanced-tools and not sure about routerboard, but if I had to touch anything else, I could as well throw out the whole ROS, because those features are required. But anyway, why should the number of packages influence anything? Even if I had every single existing package installed, it should still work.
I could also blame my OpenWRT images, I mean, they were self-compiled, not tested by anyone else, it's possible that there's something wrong with them. But then again, it's not guest OS that's crashing, it's host system. I'm no virtualization expert, but if guest system in VirtualBox on my desktop computer crashed host system, I'd say there's something horribly wrong with VB. Is it any different with MR?
Workarounds like disabling watchdog timer are no solution. If I undestand it correctly, it may sometimes prevent unnecessary reboots, but can also cause the router to freeze completely, which is unacceptable.

I wish myself more luck next time. :)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Mar 25, 2011 7:09 am

if i have metarouter with uptime of more than 2 weeks, and only reason why it is not higher is version updates. Then why not?
I believe that is the problem - most of us could not get 2 weeks of uptime with MR running.

I too gave up on MR some time ago. I ended up using a $50 Open-Mesh router reflashed with Backfire to do a simple network monitoring task.

MR could have easily done this task, but it was not stable. The customers could not afford reboots on the main router.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 31, 2011 3:36 pm

have any of you RB433AH available to try these configurations, just to see if there is a difference.

Also, if possible, can any of you try to disable watchdog on host and run some monitoring software inside metarouter (with virtual ethernet not had port attached to connect host/guest)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Apr 04, 2011 1:00 am

I can't do much. I don't have any RB433x. Currently I can play only with one remote RB450G, but I must be very careful. Reboots are acceptable outside of busy hours, lockups are not (so no playing with watchdog). Currently it still has ROS 4.16, but this week I should be able to get it upgraded to ROS 5.0.

I can share my OpenWRT images if it might help. One is trunk build from half of december and the other one is from trunk about week old. I have .config for second one. I get the same results with both.

Steps to reproduce:
- import image with 32MB RAM and unlimited disk
- don't add any network interface
- start MR
- open console
- run top in console

The console freezes in matter of seconds, minutes at most. Sometimes even before it gets to command prompt. Reboot by watchdog timer follows shortly after. Automatic Supout is enabled in Watchdog, but doesn't produce anything.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Apr 04, 2011 4:58 am

Another case where MR would be useful came up yesterday. This time with brand new RB493G and ROS 4.17 (I understood that it was mostly RB450G with problems, so why not). And really, it was much better. Except for one strange MR lockup at the beginning (I pretended that I didn't see it), it appeared stable. There were no other problems for the whole time I was playing with it (around three hours). Then I left it running. Today I connected to host router again and oops, there was reboot by watchdog timer in the log. I talked to colleague who was sitting near the router and he said it was beeping (= rebooting) the whole day. Great. So I upgraded ROS to 5.0rc11, just to lose all hope, when first reboot came two minutes after starting MR. The only difference is that instead of "watchdog timer" the reason is now called "cause 1". The router is going to production use tomorrow, without MR of course. I don't have the nerve to explain to customer, that everything under fifty reboots a day is ok. ;)
I'm have the same problem on a RG450G did try 4.17 then 5.0rc11 and now 5.0 stable, still reboots. And also writes the same in the logs as you have.
Nice to hear, others having this problem :)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:38 am

remove all the unnecessary packages can bring down the crash numbers a lot. Just think what packages you need and ones you can do without. And it is not PSU related, it just requires good one, as any other device.
Thank you for your answer! Disabling unneeded packages does indeed seem to help.

I'm running ROS 4.16 on a RB450G. The OpenWRT inside metarouter is r18199 as provided by nik247 in the "Metarouter images" thread.

Like you suggested I disabled all ROS packages except routeros-mipsbe, system, and routerboard. This increased the stability greatly, but the router still rebooted ~1-2 times/day with a reference to the watchdog timer. When I stress tested the VM with an infinite loop bash script it was active for about 4hrs at maximum CPU load. Previously that would have killed the VM within minutes.

I have now disabled watchdog and my OpenWRT uptime is at 14hrs and counting (there is no significant load on the system other than a httpd serving some continuously updating cgi scripts for monitoring).

Last time I was tinkering with this problem I remember disabling watchdog led to (temporary) router lockups instead of the reboots. As I'm not sure this will show in the logs of either the RB or in OpenWRT I will write a small ping script to see whether the VM stays up or if the "uptime" in OpenWRT is only how long the VM thinks it's been up.

Is there any other way of detecting these lockups? I am rather proficient on the linux side of things but not so much with ROS, so I apologise if this is a matter of simply "reading the logs."

Good to see the problem is being worked on.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:31 pm

idea is to monitor host 450G from outside and from guest, to see freezes happen internally too, as it is not clear yet. that is, if it is possible to reaech host system from guest when from outside there are no response (6second freeze as i see them)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:06 pm

idea is to monitor host 450G from outside and from guest, to see freezes happen internally too, as it is not clear yet. that is, if it is possible to reaech host system from guest when from outside there are no response (6second freeze as i see them)
My uptime in OpenWRT is now 20 hours with heavy load (infinite loop bash script) for at least 5 of those hours. There has been one freeze lasting about 10 minutes, with the host and guest becoming responsive at the same time and without anything in the error logs of either. There has also been two instances of the guest not responding for a very short time (less than 10 seconds), I guess that could be the kind if 6 second freeze you refer to.

I will tweak my monitor script to run inside the guest and monitor the host. Will post results once I have them.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Apr 11, 2011 5:26 pm

I don't know if this helps but...

I noticed a router w/ metarouter that was rebooting like crazy. I logged in when the metarouter had locked up (but router was still responding). Before it rebooted I looked at the metarouter through the virtual console. It spit out a bunch of strange information (and rebooted shortly after).

Oops[#1]:
Cpu 0
$ 0 : 00000000 10008200 0000004c c0387d90
$ 4 : c0387d90 c03e5cf0 0000000f 00000001
$ 8 : 00000076 00000000 00000001 00000000
$12 : c0355a90 00000000 178cb0c1 c03e5ce8
$16 : c03e5cf0 0000000f c03e5d08 0000004c
$20 : c0d73000 c03e5cf8 c03e5dd0 c0cb1b80
$24 : c03e5d40 000186a0
$28 : c03e4000 c03e5cb0 c03e5cf8 c01d61b4
Hi : 00000000
Lo : 00000000
epc : 8d53df8c 0x8d53df8c
Not tainted
ra : c01d61b4 send_request+0x78/0x94
Status: 10008203 KERNEL EXL IE
Cause : 10000010
BadVA : 8d53df8c
PrId : 0001800a (MIPS 4Kc)
Process swapper (pid: 1, threadinfo=c03e4000, task=c03e0000, tls=00000000)
Stack : c03e5d4c 0000004c c0c2a140 c0cb1b80 00000001 00000001 c03e5cf0 0000000f
c0cc5000 c03e5d08 c01d6cec c02ed030 c0198fdc c01d61b4 c0d71000 c03e5d4c
00000002 00000000 00000001 64657600 00008001 c0d6f000 00000000 00000000
0000037e 00000000 00000800 000041ed 00000001 00000000 00000000 00000000
4b4c5e18 00000000 4b4c5e18 00000000 0000004a 00000000 00001000 00000000
...
Call Trace:
[<c01d6cec>] mfs_lookup+0xb8/0x12c
[<c0198fdc>] d_alloc+0x34/0x208
[<c01d61b4>] send_request+0x78/0x94
[<c018cad4>] do_lookup+0xe4/0x1e4
[<c018e2d8>] __link_path_walk+0x10c/0x1134
[<c018e650>] __link_path_walk+0x484/0x1134
[<c020a88c>] vsnprintf+0x584/0x5fc
[<c01a94e0>] propagate_mnt+0x1bc/0x1e8
[<c018f350>] path_walk+0x50/0xb8
[<c018f518>] do_path_lookup+0x10c/0x148
[<c018f518>] do_path_lookup+0x10c/0x148
[<c0184914>] get_empty_filp+0x78/0x120
[<c018e2d8>] __link_path_walk+0x10c/0x1134
[<c01901c8>] __path_lookup_intent_open+0x60/0xbc
[<c019023c>] path_lookup_open+0x18/0x24
[<c018c504>] path_put+0x18/0x44
[<c0190464>] do_filp_open+0x9c/0x810
[<c01260d4>] release_console_sem+0x230/0x2b8
[<c019c8ac>] alloc_fd+0x74/0x154
[<c0180e04>] do_sys_open+0x6c/0x118
[<c01267c8>] printk+0x24/0x30
[<c01015f4>] init_post+0x30/0xfc
[<c0107080>] kernel_thread_helper+0x10/0x18
[<c0107070>] kernel_thread_helper+0x0/0x18


Code:<4>unaligned data access at c010a76c
unaligned data access at c010c654
Unhandled kernel unaligned access[#2]:
Cpu 0
$ 0 : 00000000 10008200 00000000 00000000
$ 4 : 8d53df80 00001161 00000001 c0389174
$ 8 : 00000d0a c03bf82e 00000010 63303130
$12 : 00002201 00000000 178cb0c1 c03e5ce8
$16 : c03e5aa8 8e270000 00000000 00000000
$20 : 00000008 c0310000 c03e5dd0 c0cb1b80
$24 : 00000010 000186a0
$28 : c03e4000 c03e5a80 c03e5cf8 c010c5b4
Hi : 00000000
Lo : 00000000
epc : c010c654 do_ade+0x1b4/0x3c0
Not tainted
ra : c010c5b4 do_ade+0x114/0x3c0
Status: 10008202 KERNEL EXL
Cause : 00000010
BadVA : 8d53df80
PrId : 0001800a (MIPS 4Kc)
Process swapper (pid: 1, threadinfo=c03e4000, task=c03e0000, tls=00000000)
Stack : 00001137 c010a76c c0340000 8e270000 fffffffa 8d53df80 00000000 fffffffd
c0104de0 0000004c c038446e 0000000c c0340000 00000004 10008200 c0126748
00000000 10008200 00000000 00000001 c0346de0 c03e5a2d 00000000 c0389174
6f64653a 00000003 00000001 436f6465 00002201 00000000 178cb0c1 c03e5ce8
fffffffa 8d53df80 00000000 fffffffd 00000008 c0310000 c03e5dd0 c0cb1b80
...
Call Trace:
[<c010c654>] do_ade+0x1b4/0x3c0
[<c0104de0>] ret_from_exception+0x0/0x24
[<c010a76c>] show_code+0x80/0x114
[<c010b528>] show_registers+0x98/0xb0
[<c010b5c4>] die+0x84/0x108
[<c010c820>] do_ade+0x380/0x3c0
[<c0104de0>] ret_from_exception+0x0/0x24


Code: 00431024 14400054 00000000 <88920000> 98920003 24020000 080431a5 0000
0000 8f830018
---[ end trace 8f3d94c9bc041f2f ]---
Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init!
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon May 09, 2011 7:24 pm

Is there going to be a fix for this or will metarouters always have these bugs?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri May 13, 2011 9:43 am

not all boards has this problem with metarouter. And yes there will be a fix for the issue eventually.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon May 23, 2011 10:34 pm

not all boards has this problem with metarouter. And yes there will be a fix for the issue eventually.
Im get caught too, by buing RB450G for virtualization.

So,.... please, can you publish list of 100% compatible routerboards for virtualization? I had to decide witch RB i had to buy for it.
 
pkelly1603
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue May 24, 2011 9:31 pm

not all boards has this problem with metarouter. And yes there will be a fix for the issue eventually.
What routerboards actually work consistently with metarouter? Any model I have ever tried it on is unstable.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:01 pm

hi, as i see i am next person having this problem :D

i bought RB450G in january 2011

virtualized openwrt
tried 5 images all with same problems - reboot of entire RB (by watchdog) or openwrt freezes
tried routeros v4.17, v5.5 - doesnt help
tried at 400MHz and 680MHz - doesnt help
cpu, ram, flash utilization of RB is low (also in openwrt)
tried to make simple config (acting as switch) - doesnt help
tried to disable most packages - help a little :)
tried many combinations of ram and flash alocation for openwrt - doesnt affect uptime
tried 24v/0.8a power supply and 24/1a POE - same behavior
out of ideas :D
maybe somebody should try to compile another OS than openwrt
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:02 pm


What routerboards actually work consistently with metarouter? Any model I have ever tried it on is unstable.
i have running RB433AH, RB1000, RB800 on my table that are not rebooting. All of them have at least one metarouter guest running that is RouterOS. Also, all have 32MB of RAM assigned, since 16MB with all packages installed is not enough.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:41 pm


What routerboards actually work consistently with metarouter? Any model I have ever tried it on is unstable.
i have running RB433AH, RB1000, RB800 on my table that are not rebooting. All of them have at least one metarouter guest running that is RouterOS. Also, all have 32MB of RAM assigned, since 16MB with all packages installed is not enough.
I had to move to RB800 too from R450G - i needed to run two metarouters - RouterOS , RB450G keeps rebooting after 15 - 20 mins, no autosupout or any other output. Tryed V4.17 and few V5.x before 5.3
 
pkelly1603
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:31 pm


What routerboards actually work consistently with metarouter? Any model I have ever tried it on is unstable.
i have running RB433AH, RB1000, RB800 on my table that are not rebooting. All of them have at least one metarouter guest running that is RouterOS. Also, all have 32MB of RAM assigned, since 16MB with all packages installed is not enough.

Are your test routerboards doing anything or just sitting there? I think it has something to do with stress on them that makes them reboot because I see a lot of variation in the amount of time it takes for them to reboot. I tried the same settings as you have on a 433AH and still have the same problems (I have even tried with all unnecessary packages disabled also).
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:24 am

hi,
i own rb450g
do you even assume what should cause this problem?
i am sure it is NOT psu related
i have already tried 24V/0.8A (20W) and 19V/4.74A (90W) psu and 24V/1A (24W) POE - uptime was never longer than 10-15 minutes (whole routeros restart or openwrt "freezes")
also i read here about disabling all unnecessary packages
i left enabled only "system" and "routerboard" (that 2 cant be disabled)
the uptime raises from 10-15 minutes to 1 hour
i tried at least 4 different openwrt images and uptimes was almost same
all of this tried with ROS4.17 then ROS5.5
i need at least 2 weeks
so again, do you even assume what should cause this problem?
is it HW or SW related?
if you have some ideas, i can test or send anything you want
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:57 am

if resources are available (router has few % of cpu left and there is ram) i have seen no difference in reboot frequency with or without load. Even simple usage patterns did not cause it to reboot more.

Reboots usually where done by watchdog, disabling it - revealed that router freezes from time to time.

At the moment idea is that problem is software related, but has to be tested on different hardware (like RB433AH - same cpu, decent amount of RAM). And that problem is, that something does not like MetaROUTER being ran on the RB450G.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:33 pm

I believe it is software related. I have the same problems on 433AH as 450g.

Also, I have noticed that routers with worse connections (higher packet loss) seem to reboot more frequently.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:22 pm

watchdog may reboot your router if it does not get the time-slice to do the "check if I am alive" and that is not a problem, since router is loaded 100% and for some long time, meaning load on the router is too big in current configuration and should be looked at and optimised if possible.

You should check with router that is not fully loaded (like 80% - 95 % load) and you should see that RB433AH will stop rebooting.

Last week i removed RB433AH that where running old version of RouterOS with several MetaROUTER guests running with 8 month uptime. Also, there might be other problems that causes reboots in your case, since i ran minimal feature set on the board to ensure that all the problems are caused by metarouter on the router.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:20 pm

something new?
still having this problem, and metarouter was only reason why i didnt bought ubiquiti routerstation pro
it is possible to return this device to reseller, because metarouter is key feature for me, and it is not working?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:03 pm

you have to contact reseller and then the same question.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Aug 16, 2011 5:43 pm

It sounds to me like Mikrotik is going to deny the existence of this problem. Then they don't have to deal with it!
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:57 am

you should learn to read. Problem is known and admitted long time ago. Since there is no reliable way to reproduce and causes are not known problem still persist. RB540G has the problem, while RB433AH with the same CPU does not. Only dependency for MetaROUTER is the CPU.

If someone wants to return the router only because it does not have working feature, he has to contact one who have sold it and make arrangements.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Sep 02, 2011 10:30 am

some suggestions to solve this problem?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:40 am

to sum it all up on RB450G:
1) choose other board, even it is MIPSBE
2) install less packages (minimal set for the task)
3) disable watchdog, if lucky, you will encounter short freezes, and everything will continue to work.

Your experience may very. Situation can change after reboot.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Sep 09, 2011 7:49 pm

your advice is to buy another board with same problem :lol:
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 12, 2011 10:12 am

your advice is to buy another board with same problem :lol:
my advice is to read carefully 8) . RB433AH have the same CPU but does not have same MetaROUTER problem. :lol:
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 13, 2011 11:54 am

you dont know what cousing this problem, so how you know rb430ah dont freeze
it is same with rb450g, not all are freezing :D
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 13, 2011 1:39 pm

as far as i have tested eventually all RB450G have frozen. As devs are explaining, only parts that metarouter uses are CPU and RAM. Testing RAM and CPU under load did not show any problems with the parts. So no, I do not know where is the problem. If i knew, i could point devs and that would have been fixed long long long time ago.

What is written in this thread that some RB450G can freeze with larger interval some with shorter, and that interval can change.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:12 pm

Ever since i got RB450G i had the metarouter problem... And since then i've been trying to find the problem.
Now my testing show's that it is a mr-network problem.

If i add 8 RouterOS metarouter's with no network connection, it runs fine for weeks, not even a single problem.
But if i add a interface (dynamic or static) to just one of the metarouter's, i starts to freak out and get unstable!
And then i can't connect to the metarouter(s) or the RB450G even not on the serial port!
Then after some time (all from a few min to hours/days) it comes back on the network and serial, then i can connect and disable the interface, then it runs fine for weeks again...


Now does who have a RB450G, can i get you to try this?
Clean install on RB450G and then add 8 Metarouters with RouterOS (no network interface) and let something like the dude monitor it (just to see if ping works).
Then let it run for a week or two.
If it still runs with no problems, try and add just one interface to a metarouter.
Then let it run for as long as it can (or just up to 1-2 weeks), then write here, with your experience.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 14, 2011 2:07 pm

after reading this in the morning i set up RB450G with metarouter configured as follows:
/metarouter add name=mr1 memory=32
/interface virtual-ethernet add
/metarouter interface add virtual-machine=mr1 type=static static-interface=ether5
/metarouter interface add virtual-machine=mr1 type=static static-interface=ether1
connected ether5 with ether1 using wire.

[admin@450G-2] > sy resource print 
                   uptime: 3h57m29s
                  version: 5.6
              free-memory: 207336KiB
             total-memory: 257120KiB
                      cpu: MIPS 24Kc V7.4
                cpu-count: 1
            cpu-frequency: 680MHz
                 cpu-load: 4%
           free-hdd-space: 464132KiB
          total-hdd-space: 520192KiB
  write-sect-since-reboot: 132
         write-sect-total: 1324790
               bad-blocks: 1.5%
        architecture-name: mipsbe
               board-name: RB450G
                 platform: MikroTik
pinging the hosts (since host is one that do not respond. (looking at max RTT since packets could stay in hosts receive buffer and the replied when router unfreezes)

no problems yet :(

will leave for some time.

edit: it was not crashing with metarouter running w/o interfaces for some time w/o crashing as described. Also, i have OSPF running on the router.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:07 pm

after reading this in the morning i set up RB450G with metarouter configured as follows:
/metarouter add name=mr1 memory=32
/interface virtual-ethernet add
/metarouter interface add virtual-machine=mr1 type=static static-interface=ether5
/metarouter interface add virtual-machine=mr1 type=static static-interface=ether1
connected ether5 with ether1 using wire.

[admin@450G-2] > sy resource print 
                   uptime: 3h57m29s
                  version: 5.6
              free-memory: 207336KiB
             total-memory: 257120KiB
                      cpu: MIPS 24Kc V7.4
                cpu-count: 1
            cpu-frequency: 680MHz
                 cpu-load: 4%
           free-hdd-space: 464132KiB
          total-hdd-space: 520192KiB
  write-sect-since-reboot: 132
         write-sect-total: 1324790
               bad-blocks: 1.5%
        architecture-name: mipsbe
               board-name: RB450G
                 platform: MikroTik
pinging the hosts (since host is one that do not respond. (looking at max RTT since packets could stay in hosts receive buffer and the replied when router unfreezes)

no problems yet :(

will leave for some time.

edit: it was not crashing with metarouter running w/o interfaces for some time w/o crashing as described. Also, i have OSPF running on the router.

I don't use OSPF on it, just a clean install and setup with metarouter.
But i think it is funny that i on my RB450G can replicate this problem time after time and even after a netinstall...
Maybe it is a faulty board then?
The only thing i wanted it to do, was run metarouters, but stacking RB750 seems to be a better idea...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:29 pm

The only thing i wanted it to do, was run metarouters, but stacking RB750 seems to be a better idea...
I've come to the same conclusion...
The 256MB of RAM in the RB450G are a total waste of ressources(and money) without Metarouter.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:21 am

running metarouter on board that before was the worst candidate if talking about stability of MetaROUTER, so the stats:

[admin@450G-2] > sy resource print 
                   uptime: 1w6d1m55s
                  version: 5.6
              free-memory: 207392KiB
             total-memory: 257120KiB
                      cpu: MIPS 24Kc V7.4
                cpu-count: 1
            cpu-frequency: 680MHz
                 cpu-load: 4%
           free-hdd-space: 464132KiB
          total-hdd-space: 520192KiB
  write-sect-since-reboot: 419
         write-sect-total: 1325077
               bad-blocks: 1.5%
        architecture-name: mipsbe
               board-name: RB450G
                 platform: MikroTik
[admin@450G-2] > sy package print 
Flags: X - disabled 
 #   NAME                                               VERSION                                              SCHEDULED              
 0   system                                             5.6                                                                         
 1   hotspot                                            5.6                                                                         
 2   routerboard                                        5.6                                                                         
 3   ipv6                                               5.6                                                                         
 4   ppp                                                5.6                                                                         
 5   security                                           5.6                                                                         
 6   mpls                                               5.6                                                                         
 7   wireless                                           5.6                                                                         
 8   advanced-tools                                     5.6                                                                         
 9   option                                             5.6                                                                         
10   routing                                            5.6                                                                         
11   ntp                                                5.6                                                                         
12   dhcp                                               5.6
[admin@450G-2] > metarouter print 
Flags: X - disabled 
 #   NAME                                                                      MEMORY-SIZE     DISK-SIZE     USED-DISK STATE        
 0   mr1                                                                             32MiB     unlimited        277kiB running 
[admin@450G-2] > metarouter interface print 
Flags: X - disabled, A - active 
 #   VIRTUAL-MACHINE                                    TYPE    STATIC-INTERFACE                                   VM-MAC-ADDRESS   
 0 A mr1                                                static  ether5                                             02:1B:7E:B1:B7:E2
 1 A mr1                                                static  vif1                                               02:16:16:90:EF:0E
[admin@450G-2] > interface virtual-ethernet print 
Flags: X - disabled, R - running 
 #    NAME                                                                                          MTU ARP        MAC-ADDRESS      
 0  R vif1                                                                                         1500 enabled    02:8B:7B:3C:33:B0

ether1 and ether5 is connected by wire

running metarouter stats:

[admin@MikroTik] > sy resource print 
                   uptime: 1w6d6m18s
                  version: 5.6
              free-memory: 20776KiB
             total-memory: 29708KiB
                      cpu: MIPS 4Kc V0.10
                cpu-count: 1
            cpu-frequency: 680MHz
                 cpu-load: 1%
           free-hdd-space: 464128KiB
          total-hdd-space: 464405KiB
  write-sect-since-reboot: 0
         write-sect-total: 0
               bad-blocks: 0%
        architecture-name: mipsbe
               board-name: RB MetaROUTER
                 platform: MikroTik
[admin@MikroTik] > interface print 
Flags: D - dynamic, X - disabled, R - running, S - slave 
 #     NAME                                                                                  TYPE               MTU L2MTU  MAX-L2MTU
 0  R  ether1                                                                                ether             1500
 1  R  ether2                                                                                ether             1500

ping from neighbor router looks like this:
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 1ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 1ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 1ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
10.5.45.5                                  56  63 0ms  
    sent=80 received=80 packet-loss=0% min-rtt=0ms avg-rtt=0ms max-rtt=2ms 
changes. before router was set up it had bad caps (the green ones that where bulged up) changed. after that nothing has been done. time difference in host and guest uptime is time to make printouts and pasting them here and doing some rearranging.
 
barkas
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:57 am

You can't seriously try to tell us that there's nothing wrong.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:04 am

Janis,

we have 3 brand new 450G in our test-setup, ALL of them are practically useless regarding stability.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:47 pm

You can't seriously try to tell us that there's nothing wrong.
all i did was report back to persons interested on how the test is going. Obviously - bad. Problem did not manifest it self, but it should have done that. At least i was hoping for that to happen.

Maybe someone could try to check this:
[admin@450G-2] /interface ethernet switch> print 
Flags: I - invalid 
 #   NAME                        TYPE         MIRROR-SOURCE                      MIRROR-TARGET                      SWITCH-ALL-PORTS
 0   switch1                     Atheros-8316 none                               none                               yes             

All i need is to make precise scenario to recreate the problem in relatively short time.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:55 pm

Well in my case, the setting was set to switch-all-ports NO. But I thought you could see this from the last suppouts I sent a while ago.
I will do another test as time allows.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:59 pm

trying to have more open conversation, so if someone who wants to help out with same problem could fill in. I am unhappy with the testing results - problem is - no scenario on how to recreate it hence, nothing useful to report to devs. It just starts to freeze when it gets "bad mood" or something.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 4:05 pm

Janis, lets see if I got this right.
1.) You test with a RB450G.
2.) You have setup your switch to switch all ports.
3.) It runs stable for you.

What if you change switch all ports to no?
In my case problems startet right away.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 4:23 pm

set to switch-all-ports=no lets wait for the results.

if you set to switch all ports=yes, do the problem stop for you?

edit: left running and sending ping requests to the router. will leave it for the night.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:05 pm

I started a quick test at my live router.
I added one Metarouter with one local dynamic interface.
ROS 5.6
Uptime at the moment 5w3d4h53m30s.
I will report back in tomorrow.

EDIT: switch all ports was set to no, I changed it to yes.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Sep 27, 2011 5:27 pm

set to switch-all-ports=no lets wait for the results.

if you set to switch all ports=yes, do the problem stop for you?

edit: left running and sending ping requests to the router. will leave it for the night.
Did just change mine from "yes" to "no" and has been running fine for about 5mins now (4½min longer than last test).
And the dude is on the case :)

*EDIT* Now 2hours later and it still runs fine... i will let it run for a day or two (maybe a week), then try the old settings and see if it fails again.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 12:14 am

nope, died on me after 2 hours
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:26 am

nope, died on me after 2 hours
Mine did run for 7hours! then the dude told me that is was down, then 2mins later it was up again.
5mins after it came up again, it went down for about 5mins and came up.
And has now been running for 1½ hours with no downtime.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:31 am

no crashes/freezes during the night
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:09 am

2 Metarouters, just pinging to the host, stable since yesterday 15:00 UTC.
Each Metarouter doesn't show a single loss, max ping rtt 13-14ms.
/metarouter
add disabled=no disk-size=32000kiB memory-size=32MiB name=chaos
add disabled=no disk-size=32000kiB memory-size=32MiB name=chaos2
/metarouter interface
add disabled=no dynamic-bridge=none dynamic-mac-address=02:1B:7E:B1:B7:E2 \
    type=dynamic virtual-machine=chaos vm-mac-address=02:45:5F:D0:20:B1
add disabled=no dynamic-bridge=none dynamic-mac-address=02:52:9C:ED:DC:EF \
    type=dynamic virtual-machine=chaos2 vm-mac-address=02:A7:68:6A:E4:9B
/ip address
add address=192.168.101.1/24 disabled=no interface=vif1 network=192.168.101.0
add address=192.168.102.1/24 disabled=no interface=vif2 network=192.168.102.0
I will change the setup now, to using an externel ethernet port.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:34 am

Conclusion by now: As both barkas and QpoX both have crashes regardless the switch switch-all-ports setting, I think we can rule that out.
Significant difference between my setup and barkas setup is, that my Metarouter does nothing more than just pinging over one interface, and barkas does full MPLS tests.
Janis maybe you could do some MPLS tests between Metarouter and host or some load tests using ipsec? Anything that touches ethernet/ip stacks and/or produces some load...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:15 pm

Here is my Log:
rb450g-Clipboard01.jpg
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:19 pm

i have had router with metarouter freeze up without MPLS. I have one suspect that i am testing out, it crashed once without debug MetaROUTER, now router sits at devs with debug version of MetaROUTER. That is thanks to new board that has similar structure as RB450G where debug mode or MetaROUTER can be monitored (it cannot be done or RB450G).

Fingers crossed it crashes again.

some details - Router was just idling same as metarouter, and then it rebooted.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:45 pm

Ok, my new Metarouter test crashed after about 3 hours.

Short sketch of the config:
1 Metarouter, 32MB RAM&Disk
2 Virtual Interfaces, one dynamic as bridge port, one static to ether2.
Pinging from Metarouter to host.
Pinging from another System connected at ether2 to Metarouter.
Only things configured in Metarouter where one IP per interface and System name.

Packages:
/system package print
Flags: X - disabled
 #   NAME                    VERSION                    SCHEDULED
 0   routeros-mipsbe         5.6
 1 X ipv6                    5.6
 2   system                  5.6
 3   mpls                    5.6
 4 X hotspot                 5.6
 5 X wireless                5.6
 6   routerboard             5.6
 7   advanced-tools          5.6
 8   security                5.6
 9   ppp                     5.6
10   routing                 5.6
11   dhcp                    5.6
12   ntp                     5.6
Switch all ports ist still set to yes.

I'am sorry, but that is about all I can supply as tests by now.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:00 pm

That is thanks to new board that has similar structure as RB450G where debug mode or MetaROUTER can be monitored (it cannot be done or RB450G).
Your devs forgot to include the AR7116 in the JTAG scan chain on the RB450G? ;)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:00 am

Here is my final log of this test... so it's no working solution...
Now all metarouter interfaces have been disabled again, and it runs stable, but no network to the virtual machines.
RB450G_Clipboard02.jpg
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Oct 11, 2011 2:46 pm

@MT/janisk:
Any progress to report?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:14 pm

I also would be really interested in the progress .....
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:31 pm

Unfortunately, who is in charge in solving the problem has no interest :)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:03 am

Unfortunately, who is in charge in solving the problem has no interest :)
just stop spamming the forums.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Oct 21, 2011 5:05 pm

Any updates about that problem? Reboots for me with metarouter, but works perfectly stable without. RB493G, 5.7
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:05 am

Does anyone know if this problem has been seen/reported on RB750GL?

I have, yet again, a useful purpose for a metarouter.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Oct 22, 2011 11:07 am

I guess you only could try yourself, there is extremely less feedback on Metarouters altogether.
And, without wanting to bash MT, there seems to be no clear understanding of the cause on MIPSBE, so every MIPSBE based board should be viewed as affected. Even a small software update might tip those boards over the edge.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:19 am

Unfortunately, who is in charge in solving the problem has no interest :)
just stop spamming the forums.
If people are asking for progress and we don't get any answer, why would you characterize my comments as spam?

@xdemon: I've never reached 24 hours uptime on 750GL with MetaROUTER activated (with OpenWRT guest). I don't know about ROS guest, didn't test. And btw, the VM was doing very light DNS traffic for home LAN.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:45 am

I don't think it's traffic related. I don't really use mine except for testing now and then and it reboots often enough.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:01 am

unfortunately it is all I can disclose. and even then some of info is just a guess :(

so, there are reports of metarouter hanging on RB450G and RB493G. Anyone with RB435G or RB411AH can try metarouter on it?

for me RB433AH does not crash. Now stuck with RB450G that does not reboot :?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:19 am

I can only repeat and clarify what I said in earlier posts:

The whole MIPSBE series should be considered unusable in combination with Metarouter.
Especially with the information available from MT and the fact that they aren't capable of fixing this problem in such a long time.

@MT:
This is not intended as pun, just as a warning to everyone planing on using Metarouter on MIPSBE based MT boards.
And don't start repeating that Metarouter is stable on "some" MIPSBE boards, this is just plain luck and might change with every change/release you make.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:58 pm

It doesn't stable even with routeros virtualized. Crashed after 10 mins with router reboot. metarouter-fs used 40-80% of cpu first 3 mins. I have autosupout.rif file, but i can't find enything useful in it.

UPD: looks like it working after reboot.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:43 pm

@xdemon:
Crashes may occur anywhere between 1minute to nearly 1day. The rate increases as you do more work inside the MR.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:54 am

It doesn't stable even with routeros virtualized. Crashed after 10 mins with router reboot. metarouter-fs used 40-80% of cpu first 3 mins. I have autosupout.rif file, but i can't find enything useful in it.

UPD: looks like it working after reboot.
send that supout.rif to support.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Oct 27, 2011 5:38 am

I can only repeat and clarify what I said in earlier posts:

The whole MIPSBE series should be considered unusable in combination with Metarouter.
Especially with the information available from MT and the fact that they aren't capable of fixing this problem in such a long time.

@MT:
This is not intended as pun, just as a warning to everyone planing on using Metarouter on MIPSBE based MT boards.
And don't start repeating that Metarouter is stable on "some" MIPSBE boards, this is just plain luck and might change with every change/release you make.
Is this problem isolated to MIPSBE or all BE processors? LE architectures do not have the problem?

If so, those are huge clues.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Oct 27, 2011 9:46 am

MIPSLE boards do not support metarouter, hence - they do not suffer from this problem. As far as i know various RB4XXG models do suffer from this problem (RB493G, RB450G, RB435G). Never seen this problem on RB433AH and similar.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:01 am

@janis:
What he meant where LE architectures in general, not necessarily MIPS-LE, I guess.
And yes, this could have an influence but at a point where it's already to late out of a developers perspective.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:11 am

le, is x86 and mipsle, both of the does not have MetaROUTER.

and this problem is not out of devs perspective. Just there is not a reliable way to reproduce it. As sometimes something starts to happen after 2 weeks other time, restarts happen once in 10 minutes.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Oct 28, 2011 4:54 am

What he meant where LE architectures in general, not necessarily MIPS-LE, I guess.
Yes
le, is x86 and mipsle, both of the does not have MetaROUTER.
Interesting. I did not know le, and in particular x86, doesn't support metarouter! This saves me a hard lesson.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:05 am

on x86 you go KVM to virtualize.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Nov 01, 2011 4:28 pm

Can anyone run 'while true;do dmesg -c;done' and see what happens? And please leave that command running in openwrt (for example in background)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Nov 01, 2011 4:48 pm

And yes, there is something i discovered in process of testing:

1) netconsole. There is no error logs sent via network - only standart boot data.
2) There is no crashdumps in openwrt machine. Basically everything is okay with openwrt.
3) i tried watching dmesg, and there is no error messages too.
4) Mikrotik MetaRouter (with RouterOS machine) sometimes hangs too.
5) And... sometimes reboots of router (physical, not virtual one)

So... this is 100% RouterOS fault. I sent supout file to mikrotik.

P.S. if we only had access to more verbose logs...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Nov 01, 2011 5:03 pm

P.S. if we only had access to more verbose logs...
But we don't, because the machine crashes hard.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:31 pm

v 5.8, still broken. Also crashes host machine.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:47 pm

Some interesting info. I enabled writing debug logs to disk, and tried to catch some messages.

Of course i haven't found any useful info, but...

There were no virtual machine freezes
Instead, router crashes hard. I always saw that first virtual machine freezes, and then router crashes (if you do not disable VM via /metarouter _before_ router crashes - if you will be fast and disable VM router will not crash)
I tried that, well, somewhere around 10 times. VM _do not freeze_. Router crashes anyway...

Maybe that somehow related to filesystem?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Nov 18, 2011 5:56 pm

I am just using metarouter so I can load OpenVPN into OpenWRT to use UDP as the transport protocol. If MT could just add the UDP option for OpenVPN instead of only TCP I bet it would solve some problems out there.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Dec 29, 2011 1:07 pm

Any news on this RB450G + Metarouter + OpenWRT problem?
I am running RB450G v5.11 and still the board crashes.

Mikrotik?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:44 pm

I wouldn't hold my breath.
Maybe a x86 Board like Soekris net6501 with KVM will be more usable; I didn't try.
I just use MikroTik/ROS for testing and home usage and gave up all planned and realized productive installations.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Jan 17, 2012 11:39 pm

unfortunately, we already paid for mikrotik board, so why are you wondering about no support...? :(
this isn`t good way to atract new customers, shame on you MT. i bought RB450G, it was my first and last product from you.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:38 am

I just use MikroTik/ROS for testing and home usage and gave up all planned and realized productive installations.
unfortunately, we already paid for mikrotik board, so why are you wondering about no support...? :(
this isn`t good way to atract new customers, shame on you MT. i bought RB450G, it was my first and last product from you.
I couldn't agree more :?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:08 am

Perhaps the problem is really in miscalculations in the design of power converters on the routerboard 450G. With a standard external power supply DVE DSA-20P-20 24V/0.8A router, when running metarouter, was unstable and often restart at arbitrary times, even in idle mode. ROS 3x, 4x, 5x - no difference. However, with the simple old transformer power supply 12V/0.5A router works fine for more than a day, with a test load in the form of Ping Speed between the router and metarouter (average 163 Mbps at a reduced up to 400 MHz cpu clock).
By the way, lowering the CPU clock from 680 MHz to 400 MHz did not affect the instability.
When using low voltage power supply, became less warm coils and capacitors in both the power converters to 3.3V on routerboard, which is an indirect proof of engineering miscalculation. And stronger heated coil, which supplies the switch chip and memory. In this scheme fits the fact, that router is a bit more stable in the mode "switch-all-ports=no".
IMHO, the designers of this model were to use a more powerful power converter, similar to that used in RB433x.
Another is the idea of replacing the electrolytic capacitors on the solid polymer capacitors. It is not excluded, that this may also solve the problem.

ps Forgive me my nice Google English :)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:51 am

the frequency of reboots of the board is not connected to PSU in any way, of course, board has to have enough resources. It was tested at full CPU load.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:42 am

I guess you only could try yourself, there is extremely less feedback on Metarouters altogether.
And, without wanting to bash MT, there seems to be no clear understanding of the cause on MIPSBE, so every MIPSBE based board should be viewed as affected. Even a small software update might tip those boards over the edge.
It's not just the MIPSBE, I have the same behavior with PPC platform, RB1000 and RB1100AH tested.
My bet is that the MetaROUTER software is unstable.
Have anyone configured the guest interfaces in dynamic mode only?
I'm wondering if the setup of static interfaces is not correctly configured in the underlaying Linux kernel.
I was convinced that static interfaces is a HW bypass directly to the guest, but I don't think so any more.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Feb 03, 2012 8:36 am

what configuration you have? All problems about MR on PPC routers was resolved by adjusting configuration
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:27 am

what configuration you have? All problems about MR on PPC routers was resolved by adjusting configuration
I have a support ticket that you are familiar with.
/Paul
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:16 pm

what configuration you have? All problems about MR on PPC routers was resolved by adjusting configuration
Can you elaborate on this? What specific configuration changes resolve MR issues on PPC routers?
Is there a wiki of sorts?

I had given up on Metarouter until mipsbe becomes stable. But if ppc is stable....

I'm installing an RB1100AH next week and could use MR for lots of things - if ppc Metrouter is stable.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:43 pm

:D Just don't configure anything and everything will be almost fine. :lol:
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:20 am

:D Just don't configure anything and everything will be almost fine. :lol:
Timberwolf, so your opinion is not to use MR at all, at least not until a stable version is available? ;)
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:32 am

Timberwolf, so your opinion is not to use MR at all, at least not until a stable version is available? ;)
Yes, that is exactly my opinion.
And my impression is, that this will be never.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:46 am

Timberwolf, so your opinion is not to use MR at all, at least not until a stable version is available? ;)
Yes, that is exactly my opinion.
And my impression is, that this will be never.
So, your saying MR in general on all platforms including PPC platform?
And you're not agree on the statement? :
http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... 11#p301963

Do you have any experience of ROS x86 KVM stability?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:27 pm


So, your saying MR in general on all platforms including PPC platform?
And you're not agree on the statement? :
http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... 11#p301963
Tweaking your configuration until the system runs stable isn't a solution.
At best that's a workarround and nothing you let your customers play with.
Do you have any experience of ROS x86 KVM stability?
No. I would like to think that this configuration might be usable, but I am unwilling to take the risk.

I'm starting to suspect that whoever wrote the MR code isn't longer working for MikroTik. So MR might be considered an abandoned technology.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:16 pm

Tweaking your configuration until the system runs stable isn't a solution.
At best that's a workarround and nothing you let your customers play with.
Totally agree on this.
As long there aren't any description and manuals provided with confirmed and tested configurations, the MR aren't usefull.
No. I would like to think that this configuration might be usable, but I am unwilling to take the risk.
I will setup an x86 appliance for heavy tests the KVM.
I'm going to test it exactly same way as I'm testing the MR
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:22 am

good, waiting for your results.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 08, 2012 5:50 pm

good, waiting for your results.
Some results, or to be more precise, different config settings between MetaROUTER and KVM.
Janis! correct me if I'm wrong about my assumptions and conclusions.

I'm trying to understand the different configurations based on my Linux knowledge and how-to configuring tun/tap, vlan and bridges in Linux OS.
When creating static interfaces in MetaROUTER, you can select physical interfaces like Ether1.
The selection list on KVM show only the interfaces already added as Virtual Ethernet interfaces. (/interface virtual-ethernet)

In MR, if I use a physical (not configured on the host) interface in a guest and add VLAN on that interface on the guest, the VLANs works.

To do the same thing in KVM I need to create a bridge with a tap interface and the physical interface I want to bind it to.
The tap interface is the interface that is attached to the guest.

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.
I have arp in the guest and the bridge host table looks alright, but the guest is not responding.
The difference between the configuration of virtual ethernet interfaces, is that in KVM you can assign MAC-address on both host and guest side, but not in MR.
If I, in MR, change from static to dynamic and assign the interface to the same bridge it all starts working again. And now, it assigns a MAC-address on the host side.

From Winbox (2.2.18) I can add and view Virtual Ethernet interfaces in KVM, but not in MR.

Is the MetaROUTER paravirtualization or just a software on the hosts that emulates a ROS?

More to come.....
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:00 am

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.

this one is interesting, now if you could give full configuration of the "same" configuration would be nice (to avoid confusions. That is mipsbe router?)

when you assign physical interface to MR tap interface is tapped into the physical interface well before a lot of stuff that works with packets in RouterOS. There are some services that can get packets on the host from that interface, but could not work around that. In KVM that is not possible. When transmit happens from MR packets are put into interface send buffer and interface just sends them out (as it usually does, as interface only concern is OSI Layer1)

MetaROUTER is not just ROS emulation, as it is possible to have OpenWRT and, as some reports say, debian running as guests. Similar to KVM, MR requires CPU virtualization support.

RouterBOARD routers will not have Virtual Ethernet tab, instead use filtering to filter out virtual interfaces if you have a lot of interfaces on the router.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:21 am

the frequency of reboots of the board is not connected to PSU in any way, of course, board has to have enough resources. It was tested at full CPU load.
Maybe ... However, with a 12 volt transformer PSU 450G uptime for over 5 days. However, I did not banished tests this time, but with a 24 volt PSU uptime does not exceed several hours even under no load.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:11 am

i have ability to set PSU voltage to value i desire in range where RB450G is working and change of that did not change stability of the setup. Maybe you could list what amperage you get at what voltage from these PSUs?

edit: check in what condition are your capacitors.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:10 pm

If I create the same configuration in MR with a bridge between a physical and virtual and the vif attached to the guest, all interfaces stops responding.

this one is interesting, now if you could give full configuration of the "same" configuration would be nice (to avoid confusions. That is mipsbe router?)

when you assign physical interface to MR tap interface is tapped into the physical interface well before a lot of stuff that works with packets in RouterOS. There are some services that can get packets on the host from that interface, but could not work around that. In KVM that is not possible. When transmit happens from MR packets are put into interface send buffer and interface just sends them out (as it usually does, as interface only concern is OSI Layer1)

MetaROUTER is not just ROS emulation, as it is possible to have OpenWRT and, as some reports say, debian running as guests. Similar to KVM, MR requires CPU virtualization support.

RouterBOARD routers will not have Virtual Ethernet tab, instead use filtering to filter out virtual interfaces if you have a lot of interfaces on the router.
OpenWRT is heavily patched to run on MetaRouter. I seriously doubt you can get anything to run without heavy modifications, e.g. full paravirtualization.

Are you sure MetaRouter does hardware virtualization on MIPS?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 5:15 pm

I wonder, if by any chance, one of the MetaRouter developers could chime in here and contribute something usefull or at least interesting...
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:28 pm

janisk

Transformer PSU used DVE DV-1250UP 12V/0.5A
450G when operating this PSU at idle consumes 0.36A with running Metarouter and 0.31A with a stopped Metarouter

The problem with the electrolitic capacitors Suxxon me know :) see here and here. These capacitors from the main DC/DC converter (7...28V to 3.3V) were replaced in advance by electrolitic Nichicon 1000.0/6.3V, combined with a faulty motherboard. The input capacitor 330.0/35V I have not replaced, he works in a relatively comfortable conditions.

In the plans to test the stability of pulsed PSU Powertron PA1008-2DE 12V/0.5A. And how will his free time, to measure the waveform at several control points on the power rails. It also plans after checking power supplies want to replace electrolytic capacitors with polymeric and verify with the standard 24V PSU.

p.s. There is also a possibility that could fail PoE switch logic, such as short-term switch, which is why just lost power. Unfortunately, I have no design scheme to say this objectively.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:52 am

I wonder, if by any chance, one of the MetaRouter developers could chime in here and contribute something usefull or at least interesting...
all questions are delivered to MetaROUTER devs
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:15 am

So will this ever be fixed at all?
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:12 am

Stability test with a pulse PSU Powertron PA1008-2DE 12V/0.5A is successful. RB450G uptime 5 days.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:59 am

with all links active and with CPU loaded 0.5A @12V can be too short. You could be lucky with any other PSU. But good to hear that you have it running for 5 days now.
 
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:46 pm

No, only four active link and a regular on an Internet surfing. But even in this mode with 24V PSU uptime does not exceed several hours.
"Native" 24V PSU tried two things - with both equally unstable.
p.s. It is still checking PSU. Ahead - a study with an oscilloscope. ))
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:43 pm

No, only four active link and a regular on an Internet surfing. But even in this mode with 24V PSU uptime does not exceed several hours.
"Native" 24V PSU tried two things - with both equally unstable.
p.s. It is still checking PSU. Ahead - a study with an oscilloscope. ))

Really, oscilloscope? End result. The feature seems to just not work.
 
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janisk
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:17 pm

or id having just system and security packages it works for very long times (sometimes)
 
Begetan
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:10 am

Today I began to test Metarouter on RB493G platform, ROS5.12

I'm runing defult configuration on host router and two MR - one with ROS 5.12, the other with DDWRT images from this manual http://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:Metarouter.

Every router has one static and one dynamic port. Thats all.
I'v got 3 crashes ( with systems reboot) with interval from 15 to 90 minutes.
I see that RB45x and RB49x devices not sutable for MR feature about 3 years :shock:

Could anybody answere below question?

1. Does this problem deal with only DDWRT or ROS Virtual machine too?
2. How it works on PPC architecture?
3. What device is the most stable for runing MR wit ROS Image? How long uptime they have?
 
peson
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:22 pm


1. Does this problem deal with only DDWRT or ROS Virtual machine too?
2. How it works on PPC architecture?
3. What device is the most stable for runing MR wit ROS Image? How long uptime they have?
As you can read from my previous posts, the MR aren't useful in any platform.
If you want virtualization in ROS, go for x86 platform and run KVM (Qemu) guests.

/Paul
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jul 02, 2012 6:48 pm

Did this ever get solved? Or all is lost?
 
timberwolf
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:12 pm

MT claims to be close to a fix, have a look here: http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=60746
 
rviteri
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Re: RB450G + openwrt Metarouter strange problem

Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:07 am

Doesn't look like it to me..

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