Hy all. On 16-06-2007, we (CISAR, a radioHAM italian association) have realized a 304km link (about 100km ground and 200km sea surface), between Amiata mount (1734asl) and Limbara mount (1300 ca asl). We utilized a pair of wrap board (but they will be replaced by a new RB532 soon), a pair of Ubiquiti XR5, and a pair of handmade antenna (120cm satellite dish for the surface, and a bronze ball-bearing extracted from a bus). The signal received on both end was from -58dBm to -62dBm, bitrate between 12 and 48Mbps, CCQ between 70 and 100.
IW5CGM and IK0TCL on Amiata mountain
Me (IZ3HAD) on Amiata Mountain
IK0PCJ and IK0YUK on Limbara site.
IW0UIF on Limbara Mountain
The feed (we used the feed on the left)
On the moment i'm writing, this seems to be a distance world record (the precedent was from "Politecnico di Torino" on Italy, 295km). The people which partecipate on this WR:
Amiata Mount - Giuseppe IW5CGM (CISAR president); - Antonello IK0TCL - Mirco IZ3HAD (me)
Limbara Mount - Natale IW0UIF - Paolo IK0PCJ (antenna's constructor) - Mauro IK0YUK
73 de IZ3HAD, Mirco
Last edited by mipland on Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:40 pm, edited 3 times in total.
@GotNet (or N4HHA): this is the natural evolution of the old FM repeater, no more echolink needed, hi!
@rickard: TCP band, on a bandwidth of 5MHz, was about 5Mbps. The most important thing was the latency: it was between 8 and 20ms. We tested it with the routerboard onboard b-test from one of the two site. I'm sorry, but i can't provide a real traffic data speed (PC-PC), becouse, on Amiata's mountain, there was a loooot of radio frequency (3 FM repeater @ 6kw - 3 x 2kw - at 3m that pointed us), and we can't made a succesfully connection between the board and a pc (the board was only 10m from the pc!). The link was dismantled at the end of the day, and it will be reran on the end of August (we will have a permanent authorization for that date).
EDIT: I posted some photo of the feed on the first post of this thread.
OMG!!! Last time we made a record (261,1km, it was only an italian record) we was "defeated" only 3 days after by a 295km link. We are very unlucky.... Next time we will look for a 1000km link to be sure that our record will not beated as soon as this two times!
They have 6W amps, a stratospheric balloon 30km high, 2.4 meters dish antenna controlled by automatic tracking system using GPS, The Swedish Space Corp. partnership, 3k€ or more equipment (only motherboard + radio card, of course), 2,4GHz. 310km.
We have: NO amps (600mW card lowered then to 10mW), 1700m asl one site and 1300m asl the other site, 120cm dish antenna with self-made feed controlled by...my (and my friend) hands , NO partnership, 300€ or less (total) equipment (motherboard + radio card + pigtail + case....of course), 5,7GHz (more fading, more dispersion, more free space loss). 304km.
Ok, you are right, THEY have the records (on 2,4GHz, of course), but...can you compare this two situations (for 6km difference)?
This was only a test link, which will be reinstalled as a fixed link on late August 2007, but we have test it for about 3-4 hour, and it was rock-solid. More details when we will rebuild that link on, as i wrote above, late August 2007.
They have 6W amps, a stratospheric balloon 30km high, 2.4 meters dish antenna controlled by automatic tracking system using GPS, The Swedish Space Corp. partnership, 3k€ or more equipment (only motherboard + radio card, of course), 2,4GHz. 310km.
We have: NO amps (600mW card lowered then to 10mW), 1700m asl one site and 1300m asl the other site, 120cm dish antenna with self-made feed controlled by...my (and my friend) hands , NO partnership, 300€ or less (total) equipment (motherboard + radio card + pigtail + case....of course), 5,7GHz (more fading, more dispersion, more free space loss). 304km.
Ok, you are right, THEY have the records (on 2,4GHz, of course), but...can you compare this two situations (for 6km difference)?
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 3:25 pm Posts: 92
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Gr8 work Mirco!. I'm also in Italy, but at Como. Did u do test 4 your real throughput in a Full-Dúplex (I ask u because I'm a WISP and I use MTK and other products).
is there any chance you would post some blueprints or instructions to build a similar dish from?
Hy. I will ask to the feed constructor if he can give me all the interesting measure. The antenna was made by a 120cm satellite dish (prime focus) and a hand made feed (simple dipole on a waveguide enclosure, as you can see on my last photo).
Did u do test 4 your real throughput in a Full-Dúplex (I ask u because I'm a WISP and I use MTK and other products).
Hy friend, thanks for your congratulations! I'm sorry, but i'm unable to answer to your question, becouse the link was dismantled on the same evening, and we can't do many test, becouse on one site we was unable to "talk" to the routerboard (many many many radiofrequency on that site!). This link will be re-established on late August, and on that moment i will let you know ALL tech info.
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2006 3:25 pm Posts: 92
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mipland wrote:
ivaring wrote:
Did u do test 4 your real throughput in a Full-Dúplex (I ask u because I'm a WISP and I use MTK and other products).
Hy friend, thanks for your congratulations! I'm sorry, but i'm unable to answer to your question, becouse the link was dismantled on the same evening, and we can't do many test, becouse on one site we was unable to "talk" to the routerboard (many many many radiofrequency on that site!). This link will be re-established on late August, and on that moment i will let you know ALL tech info.
Friend, i understand, I've same problem, that's because I'm using 10GHz links on Milan.
Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 12:09 pm Posts: 168
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mipland wrote:
They have 6W amps, a stratospheric balloon 30km high, 2.4 meters dish antenna controlled by automatic tracking system using GPS, The Swedish Space Corp. partnership, 3k€ or more equipment (only motherboard + radio card, of course), 2,4GHz. 310km.
We have: NO amps (600mW card lowered then to 10mW), 1700m asl one site and 1300m asl the other site, 120cm dish antenna with self-made feed controlled by...my (and my friend) hands , NO partnership, 300€ or less (total) equipment (motherboard + radio card + pigtail + case....of course), 5,7GHz (more fading, more dispersion, more free space loss). 304km.
Which btw also means that you were respecting the Italian power limits (even if i understand that you may user higher EIRP power than commercial WISP), while they were not. You did a great job guys Bye, Ricky
Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:08 pm Posts: 41
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Location: India
first of all congratulations on the job.
Want to know if you have used Nstreme protocol, can you please send comlpete details relating to this, like: 1. if you have used then what was your configuration at both ends, 2. if not then didnt you face ack-timeout issue for sucha long link
if you want , we try a link to about 400km. We have a tower on Vesuvio and a lot of friends in CB ...
Ciao Marco, we have too some tower on Vesuvio, but i'm unable (at the moment) to find a second site at 400 (or more) kilometers, becouse of the earth curvature.
Want to know if you have used Nstreme protocol, can you please send comlpete details relating to this, like: 1. if you have used then what was your configuration at both ends,
Yes, we used Nstreme, becouse without it, it's simply impossible (becouse of the ack timeout limit on Atheros firmware - ideally 61km max shoot -). We configured one end as ap bridge with static wds, and the other end as wds station with dynamic wds, 5MHz bandwidth, 5765MHz frequency.
mksb wrote:
2. if not then didnt you face ack-timeout issue for sucha long link
No ack timeout, look above.
mksb wrote:
also, can you describe more about your antenna
It's very simple: - 1 x satellite dish prime focus; - 1 x handmade waveguide (a sort of "cantenna") on the dish's focus.
what kind of nstreme are you using single or dual ??
Single nstreme.
mksb wrote:
you didnt had to tune the antenna for 5ghz frequency ...
I don't understand what you are asking here...we (ik0pcj, Paolo) have realized only the feed, and then we have tested it with a SWR meter. We have compared on a short link with a 29dBi pac wireless grid, and we have 6/7dBi more (rx/tx) (so 35dBi total) than with the grid.
No. I wrote on some post that this link was only a test link (it was active from 14:00 to 19:00 of one day). We will rebuild the link on late August or first of September, becouse we lack the necessary authorization.
Yes, it's legal if we are physically at the site, becouse we are OM. On the moment we leaved the station, we have to lower the power to 10W EIRP, but this is not a problem now, becouse the link was down till the day we made it (we are waiting for necessary authorization).
Good job i would like have more daitals about your link: - The power of the used card (is it 600mW??) - The gain of the antenna?? - Have you used Lowloss cables?? if yes witch cables are used (LMR 400?? or LMR900??) and how long are you cables?? - What about climatic conditions?? there was clouds, fogs ??
Hy Normunds, this news is an old news. You can see on your forum that this link was made on 16th of June 2007, and at that time, it has a lot of resonance. On that news (and on our technical bullettins, downloadable from our site) we specified the use of Mikrotik routerOS. Unfortunately, at the time of the link, we didn't have any Routerboard, only PCEngines WRAP. Next week we will re-establish that link (probably with Routerboard), but this time it will be a fixed installation (at the time of the link, we hasn't the necessary authorization), and i will publish all the tech detail on the same thread i started on June 2007 on your forum. Then, if you want to made a sort of "pubblications" (as Ubiquiti did), we will provide you all the necessary info.
The news you are seeing is a sort of "partnership" (they will provide us some testing hardware for free) between CISAR and Ubiquiti, and it's from Ubiquiti's commercial/publisher (but with our approvation). They have seen the post on your forum 2 months later...
On EVERY our pubblications (except for that Ubiquiti's pubblications), Mikrotik RouterOS is higly mentioned as "fundamental firmware".
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