I have a number of pseudobridge WiFi devices scattered around. Now, I wanted to update them all to newer ROS, but then it dawned on me that new ROS does not contain wireless drivers...

Am I correct that after 7.12.1 I will have to physically access device to update it? Or is there a way to prepackage wireless driver and install it together with ROS?

(Is it maybe prudent to leave those mobile devices on LTS branch?)

I understand the constraints, but this driver issue complicates things a lot for certain setups...

If you use the normal upgrade proces (System / upgrade packages / Download and install) then 7.13 will "automagically" take care of required extra packages where needed (actually, the hooks are present in 7.12 since that's the one doing the download).

It's even so that on some device NOT having wireless capability, wireless package IS installed although completely unneeded (I already saw it on CRS326, a switch).

BUT ...
if your devices are 16-Mb Flash devices, I would strongly advice to STAY on 7.12.
The complete package (ROS + wireless) became a bit bigger then it used to be in the past because now default wave2 support is included in ROS package. So that comes on top even though it may not be needed for your setup.
Mikrotik is working on slimming down the total size again but until that has been done, stay on 7.12 unless there are some bugs/features which you really need. Be prepared then ...

As usual, try to test on same device with same setup in a lab-environment so you don't have to book a plane-ticket

If you use the normal upgrade proces (System / upgrade packages / Download and install) then 7.13 will "automagically" take care of required extra packages where needed (actually, the hooks are present in 7.12 since that's the one doing the download).

It's even so that on some device NOT having wireless capability, wireless package IS installed although completely unneeded (I already saw it on CRS326, a switch).

But this is not so?

I have been updating some 30 CAP, CAP AC and Cap Lite devices today and not one also updated the wireless package automatically. I know, as I have a checklist and check status of all of them manually?

(I do agree that staying on 7.12.1 seems a good idea.)

And yet it is

Pre-7.13 there is no need for wireless package on your devices.
Legacy drivers are included in ROS.

As of 7.13 this changes: wave2 is default present in ROS but not the complete package. Only basic support.
What also changed with 7.13 is you can now have capsman controller for BOTH wifi-environments on the SAME device.
This was not possible before.
(caveat: preferably a controller without own radios or you would loose those radios if both drivers are loaded)

So ...
example cap AC
pre-7.13: only ROS (since legacy wifi is included)
as of 7.13: ROS PLUS wireless package (since wave2-hooks are basic included now, so you need to load legacy wireless drivers)

example cAP AX
pre-7.13: ROS + wifi-qcom
as of 7.13: ROS + wifi-qcom (smaller wifi-package since base support is in ROS)

Excuse my ignorance, but how?

I have done a number of upgrades today, both to 7.12.1 and then to 7.13.5, and not one of the updates installed legacy wireless package automatically.

All of these were active CAPs, and until I specifically installed wireless package, this didn't work.

As for the Capsman, yes, I am aware of Wave 2 and later drivers, however I currently have decided against implementing it on a larger scale on current implementation. The reason is that I need to configure and monitor an additional capsman controller, which I wouldn't prefer. The general idea I had is to do this at the point of replacing all of the old CAPs at some point in the future and do it then.

HOW did you do these upgrades ?
Should be done using System / packages / upgrade (Winbox or CLI)
Don't simply drop ROS package on files and reboot. If you used that approach, you should have dropped wireless as well.

Every single legacy wifi device I upgraded past 7.12 towards 7.13.x, got the wireless package nicely installed as well. No failures (only 3 times a wireless package where it should not be required, CRS326).

HOW did you do these upgrades ?
Should be done using System / packages / upgrade (Winbox or CLI)
Don't simply drop ROS package on files and reboot. If you used that approach, you should have dropped wireless as well.

Every single legacy wifi device I upgraded past 7.12 towards 7.13.x, got the wireless package nicely installed as well. No failures (only 3 times a wireless package where it should not be required, CRS326).

Ah... I upgraded through the system packages to 7.12 and then manually from then on. That's the source of error then...

If I understand you correctly, if I do a manual upgrade, I need to drop BOTH the ROS and Wireless package, and then I will achieve having both packages installed at the same time?

Best to use the approach I mentioned.
Then you are sure.

I am not 100% sure you can drop both when upgrading. Never tried.
But system / packages / upgrade will properly take care of it.

I am not 100% sure you can drop both when upgrading.

It worked like this in v6 and I don't see any readon why it wouldn't work in 7.12 (or any other v7).

Maybe because of the special upgrade path because of change of wireless/ wave2 ?
Don't know. As said: I didn't try.

The required upgrade path is expressly for in-ROS upgrade (because old ROS needs to fetch extra packages / packages with different names). Has nothing to do with installation of packages, manually uploaded to device.

A gotcha though: IIRC one had to upload package files for all currently installed packages. Without this, update would fail. So simply uploading routeros and wifi-qcom package files on device which has (pre 7.13) routeros and wifiwave2 package installed would fail (because of missing wifiwave2). But if one marked wifiwave2 for uninstall beforehand, then upgrade (by uploading the mentioned 2 files) would likely succeed.

Much easier to follow the normal path

Indeed.

So... call me stupid, but I still don't understand is it doable or not.. I will have to dig one older ap and test.

It's not rocket science.

If you go the manual road, it MIGHT be possible you need to handle this in 2 steps. But you will only know once you see it failing.
If you go the normal road as foreseen in Winbox/CLI, it SHOULD be a one-step thing. Also there, log file after reboot will tell you were you are.

Obviously both options depending on available space on your device. We can't know what else you got loaded on it which might become a show-stopper for both approaches.

I have tested this on mAP lite:

1. update to 7.12.1 worked as it should

2. update to 7.13.5 where i also added wireless package manually when updating also worked as it should

So I conclude that it is indeed possible to manually install both the system and wireless package at once during an upgrade from earlier (7.12.1-7.12.2) version.

It's not rocket science.

If you go the manual road, it MIGHT be possible you need to handle this in 2 steps. But you will only know once you see it failing.
If you go the normal road as foreseen in Winbox/CLI, it SHOULD be a one-step thing. Also there, log file after reboot will tell you were you are.

Obviously both options depending on available space on your device. We can't know what else you got loaded on it which might become a show-stopper for both approaches.

Yes, but if I want to update to specific version from 7.12.1 I can't use direct update / upgrade. - The bigger issue lurking here is the fact that we still don't have LTS ROS 7. I find that a very big issue, and I need the wireguard.

Ideally, I would just leave stuff on LTS ROS 6, but I am lured with new functionalities.