Hap AC2 - crap wifi 5GHz

RouterOS Wireless Networking
21

That plastic foot actually “clicks” in the bottom of the hAP ac2. The current position of this acryllic plate is for wall mounting.
The hAP ac2 has a good all-round spectrum distribution, and low antenna gain and behaves BETTER than a device with large antennas that have an antenna gain of lets say 8.
The reason is that to comply with the regulations, the maximum signal strength in the concentrated direction is defining the limit. An AP with high antenna gain will send out much less energy than an AP with low antenna gain in the other directions. In house this makes the hAP, cAp and wAP a better device for signal distribution than an Omnitik or SXTsq, which are meant for free field outdoor usage, because the path of the signal is unknown. Remember that passing a wall under an angle or in a corner makes it a thicker wall.

Very pleased with the performance of the Mikrotik devices, if you know what you are doing (the client device is the limiting factor in wifi communication in almost all cases, a 5-bar wifi signal means nothing in this). The TX power used is a bid hidden, it is the STATUS of the WLAN interface (like:Channel: 5540/20-Ce/ac/DP(24dBm) ) If you want higher signal strength than 17 dBm then you must look at the country info in CLI, and use other frequencies, like this one 5540MHz. This is limited to 40 MHz bandwidth (20-Ce) on purpose to improve the wifi experience.
I have no problem communicating through 2 walls an one concrete ceiling with hAP,cAP and wAP. One cannot expect more from the legal and safe/healthy signal strength..

22

Glad to see that more people recommend multiple accesspoints, having a single accesspoint in a house really makes no sense!
Besides, MikroTik wireless is incredibly stable. But…you have to do a lot of tweaking and need some knowledge about WiFi. @TS: expectations are incorrect (in my opinion) and you can do a lot of optimizations to your configuration.

23

There is a LOT of misunderstanding in the wifi world. On-line shops still claim they have the more powerfull, very strong signal, APs. Far above the legal and usefull limits (26dBm( radio)+8dBm (antenna gain)+3dBm (2 antennas)). It does only give you a 5-bar signal reading on your smartphone, but not usable wifi.

Starting with “auto” as frequency is a totally unpredictable setup. It could be acceptable, but the outcome can be devastating. No one can tell how this will perform, it depends … on the environment. And then setting installation “indoor”, is like challenging that auto-algoritme while giving it a severe handicap to start with.

And we are not in the “coverage” era anymore, “capacity” is what one really wants.

24

From: https://i.mt.lv/cdn/rb_files/hAP_ac_2_tower-180130162454.pdf

“New design universal case allows unit to be positioned either horizontally (desktop) or vertically (tower case). Wall anchored mounting kit is provided.”

In addition, I’ve used my hAP ac2 in both positions and didn’t notice any difference in wireless coverage in my house.

25

I’ve seen a lot of people bragging about their new “gaming” router with dozens of antennas sticking out in every direction and so many blinking lights that you can see the thing from orbit. “Moar power!!!” They don’t stop to think that their smartphone doesn’t have unlimited transmitting power, so being able to receive from the AP when you’re down the street doesn’t matter because the return signal from your phone will never reach the AP.

I don’t know how Mikrotik does their auto frequency settings. If it actually looks for the channel with the least amount of traffic, as well as evaluating which channels have stronger existing signals, it might do a good job. However, if it doesn’t change the channel once it’s set (at least until a reboot or power cycle), it could well choose a channel that’s a problem. For instance, I have noticed that I never see one of my neighbor’s SSIDs showing up during the day on weekdays. Maybe they turn their equipment off when they’re not at home. (It’s also always on the same 2.4GHz channel and I don’t see anything that looks like it’s the same device on 5.8.) There are also a couple of HP printers that only show up in the evening or one weekends, probably again because that’s when they’re actually powered on.

If my router is booted up mid-day on Wednesday, it might pick a channel that’s free then, but is very crowded in the evening.

I also see that some neighbors are using 2.4GHz channels other than 1, 6, or 11. Most of what I see is 1, 3, and 6. I’ve got my router manually set to 11 and it does ok. I’ve got most of my devices set to use ch 36 on 5GHz though, because so far it’s been pretty clear, whether because of more limited range that 2.4 or because fewer people have new APs that can use 5 GHz channels.

Does the “indoor” vs. “any” or “outdoor” setting really make that much difference? I’ve got it set to indoor, but I’ve also set my channels manually.

26

I only have a single access point in my house. It's a 2000 sq ft single level house and I actually get good, reliable wifi coverage in the house. I've thought about going to multiple APs and reducing the transmit power on each, but so far I haven't seen a need to do that. We're thinking about building a deck in the back though, so maybe if we do that and it turns out we don't get good wifi coverage there I'll move to multiple APs.

27

“I also see that some neighbors are using 2.4GHz channels other than 1, 6, or 11. Most of what I see is 1, 3, and 6. I’ve got my router manually set to 11 and it does ok. I’ve got most of my devices set to use ch 36 on 5GHz though, because so far it’s been pretty clear, whether because of more limited range that 2.4 or because fewer people have new APs that can use 5 GHz channels.

Does the “indoor” vs. “any” or “outdoor” setting really make that much difference? I’ve got it set to indoor, but I’ve also set my channels manually.”
Also my experience. Many devices (4G boxes etc) delivered by ISP’s in Europe tend to set the frequency at 3,5,7 and 9. There is probably the lowest energy level detected around. They don’t care this is very selfisch and self-destructing, as they use 40 MHz channel width on 2.4 GHz as well.
The difference between indoors/outdoors/all setting in Mikrotik limits the channels you can choose from when set to regulatory domain and select a country.
If you set “outdoor”, what is the mandatory choice for some devices like the SXTSQ 5 ac, Omnitik AC,… then you can not select an indoor frequency from the regulatory domain country set.
(Other combinations to check. Indoor should allow outdoor as well, as the signal remains inside, but it seems not to be defined that way.)
Indoors tend to be limited to 20dBm, Outdoors to 27 dBm, quite a difference if you are at the limit of a good connection.

Regulatory info via CLI:

[admin@hAPac2] /interface/wireless/info> country-info
country: etsi
ranges: 2402-2482/b,g,gn20,gn40(20dBm)
5170-5250/a,an20,an40,ac20,ac40,ac80,ac160,ac80+80(23dBm)/passive,indoor
5170-5330/a,an20,an40,ac20,ac40,ac80,ac160,ac80+80(20dBm)/dfs,passive,indoor
5250-5330/a,an20,an40,ac20,ac40,ac80,ac160,ac80+80(20dBm)/dfs,passive,indoor
5490-5710/a,an20,an40,ac20,ac40,ac80,ac160,ac80+80(27dBm)/dfs,passive
5190-5310/a-turbo(20dBm)/dfs
5180-5300/a-turbo(20dBm)/dfs
5520-5680/a-turbo(27dBm)/dfs,passive
5510-5670/a-turbo(27dBm)/dfs,passive
902-927/b,g,g-turbo,gn20,gn40(30dBm)

28

Hi,
I don’t know if You still have an issue. What I have noticed recenlty with mikrotik wifi is that it may vary tx/rx strenght a LOT on different channels.
I observed this behaviour with 60 GHz links (only 1 channel out of 4 gives super performance, stability, and stable signal power).
I observed this with hap ac2 at 5 GHz. Try out this settings and different channels:
COuntry: sri lanka
Instalation: any
Frequency-mode: manual-tx-power
Band: 5GHz-A/N/AC
Channel width: 20/40/80MHz XXXX

For me frequency 5200 work very well. Now i have signal strenght in registartion table -55, on different channel and settings it was -70. Exactly the same place, laptop, environment.
That looks to me like antennas or analog part of the radio is mismatched to certain frequencies.

29

For me frequency 5200 work very well. Now i have signal strenght in registartion table -55

  1. with XXXX you have no control over which freq will be used, 20 MHz wide control channel (C) position can be Ceee, eCee, eeCe, eeeC. However with the non-DFS nature of that 5200 frequency , it will be eCee (5180-5200-5220-5240) by Mikrotik, as MT avoids mixing non-DFS and DFS appearantly. Check it in “status” of WLAN interface.
  2. with installation “any” you have the correct setting. Nobody forbids outdoor frequencies to be used indoor, only Mikrotik device does this with “installation=indoor”
  3. 5200 is not your “strongest” signal possible. It’s only max 17 dBm (including antenna gain of 3dBm), even if you set higher manual TX-power under “regulatory domain”
    BUT: interesting country “sri lanka” as that country allows for Frequency-mode=“manual-txpower” (!?) while setting the country frequencies.
    If I use this here (under ETSI regulation of 23dBm) the received signal at the laptop (inSIDDer sniffing) jumps from -61dBm to -55dBm.
    Very tempting with all those non-compliant AP’s around, giving a +10dBm signal strength even when set to the correct country.
    But it is illegal.
    Klembord-2.jpg
  4. What do you mean with “strength in registration table=-55”. Registration table in the Mikrotik AP shows the received signal strength of the client device. Or is it the strength in the client device?
30

The hapac2 is an excellent wired router for the price, can handle up to 1gig fiber connection.

31 
/interface wireless info country-info "new zealand 5.8 fixed p-p"
  ranges: 5735-5835/a,an20,an40,ac20,ac40,ac80,ac160,ac80+80(53dBm)/outdoor

really? 53dBm???

32

It says “p-p” … which implies use of big parabolic antennae, where antenna gain easily surpasses 30dBi … and that means power amplifier output of 2x 100mW (3dB+20dBm=23dBm).

33

It can hardly handle any fiber connection … it hasn’t got SFP/SFP+ cage. :stuck_out_tongue:

34

What have surprised me is than is the only country than allow more than 30dBm…
(on MikroTik internal database)
Routeros-7.1.5-mipsbe\bndl\wireless\nova\etc\wirelessrd

35

Sorry, I meant to say up to fibre internet with ethernet copper ports - picky picky picky, you must have copious amounts of dried snot in the two biggest nostrils on the planet. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

36

I was thinking about the exact same remark so I’m glad I am not alone.
And I could predict that sort of response…

37

hahahah says the man from the land of phlegm ( I think you get the pun ) :wink: