Nstream is not suitable for 2x2 ?

[Wavelan]

@uldis

@sup5

normis, but what do you say about my findings?

could you test if this problem effects AP, Client or Both.
Could you test in which cases you have problems?

1. AP v5.14, Client v6.1
2. AP v6.1, Client v5.14
3. AP v6.1, Client v6.1

Then tell us in which of those three cases the nstreme is working fine and in which not.
After the findings maybe you could provide us with remote access to this link where you have the above problems.

Dear all,

i can reconfirm that :

in mikrotik version from 5.22 and 5.25 combination from :

• nstreme
• dual chain
• rb911g-5hnD or rb711-5hnD
• 802.11n dual chain

is very unstable, have many disconnection because poll timeout.

16:31:39 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, too many poll timeouts
16:33:24 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: connected
16:44:24 system,info,account user admin logged out from 10.31.64.36 via winbox
17:27:11 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, extensive data loss
17:27:32 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: connected
17:27:46 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, extensive data loss
17:28:04 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: connected
17:33:11 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, too many poll timeouts
17:33:28 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: connected
17:34:22 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, extensive data loss
17:37:23 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: connected
17:45:25 wireless,info D4:CA:6D:5B:2D:65@wlan0: disconnected, extensive data loss

We had to change many things :

• disable periodic calibration
• change frequency

Even we’re using good antenna (solid parabolic) and in multiple location both noisy and clean,
the sytomp is the same.

I can’t downgrade to 5.14 and 4.16 because rb911g can’t use 4.xx or even 5.14.

Thx
//Rudi

[dada]

My experience with nstreme is that it doesn’t work with 2x2 MIMO and it has problems with even 1x1 802.11N. If the 802.11N (1x1 or 2x2) is used with Nstreme than the link quality is poor and the modulation speeds tends to show random behavior.
The last test case was before few days. PtP link with 2xRB411AH, ROS5.25, DBII wifi cards, 2x Jirous JRC-24 Extreme parabolic antennas, rx level in each chain better than -59dBm. Initially the 802.11N with 2x2 MIMO enabled and nstreme was used. The link throughput was very bad and unstable. CCQ anywhere between 20-60 and the modulation speed deep under 130mbps. When the link was switched to NV2 the CCQ level raised to 90+ and the modulation speed holds on 130mbps

[Ivoshiee]

Interesting. I’ve experiencing similar issues with my nstream links - links are going down despite strong signal level. I’ve suspected interference etc. Now I’ll try nv2 to see if it will make a change.

[dada]

@Ivoshiee

Interesting. I’ve experiencing similar issues with my nstream links - links are going down despite strong signal level. I’ve suspected interference etc. Now I’ll try nv2 to see if it will make a change.

or you can try to switch (temporarily) to 802.11A (one end is enough - select the nearer one). You will run on one chain and max modulation will be 54mbps but you will see of the link is good or not (assuming that you have chain0 on both ends in the same polarisation - if not you will see significant RX signal drop or the link will not connect at all)

[tomaskir]

Ticket #2013070266000658

SXTG 5HnD <-----> SXTG 5HnD
600meter PtP link, clear LoS and clear fresnel zone.
nstreme with v6.1.

[Robinson]

I have read all the posts related to similar problems but have not found anything concrete…

We have P2P link on cca 12km, jirous dish (MIMO 29 dBi) anthenna on bot sides. One side is RB433GL with R52HN card, other side RB711-5HnD.
Signal streinght is 60/60 ccq: 98/98…100/100
Spectrum is completely free and there is no interference on 5Ghz band and this channel.
Must use nstreme becouse I can not afford the high ping (nv2).
I thought it was a problem in nstreme and “5Ghz-n” wireless mode but now conf. is in “5Ghz-a” mode and it is the same…

Client side report ewery 30-60 min:lost connection, not polled for too long
Bridge: disconnected, too many poll timeouts

Station (RB433GL with R52HN) conf.:

jul/03/2013 08:10:03 by RouterOS 5.24

software id = *******

/interface wireless security-profiles
set [ find default=yes ] authentication-types=“” eap-methods=passthrough group-ciphers=aes-ccm group-key-update=5m
interim-update=0s management-protection=disabled management-protection-key=“” mode=none name=default
radius-eap-accounting=no radius-mac-accounting=no radius-mac-authentication=no radius-mac-caching=disabled
radius-mac-format=XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX radius-mac-mode=as-username static-algo-0=none static-algo-1=none static-algo-2=
none static-algo-3=none static-key-0=“” static-key-1=“” static-key-2=“” static-key-3=“” static-sta-private-algo=none
static-sta-private-key=“” static-transmit-key=key-0 supplicant-identity=MikroTik tls-certificate=none tls-mode=
no-certificates unicast-ciphers=aes-ccm wpa-pre-shared-key=“” wpa2-pre-shared-key=“”
/interface wireless
set 0 adaptive-noise-immunity=none allow-sharedkey=no antenna-gain=0 area=“” arp=proxy-arp band=5ghz-a basic-rates-a/g=
6Mbps basic-rates-b=1Mbps bridge-mode=enabled channel-width=20mhz compression=no country=croatia
default-ap-tx-limit=0 default-authentication=yes default-client-tx-limit=0 default-forwarding=yes dfs-mode=none
disable-running-check=no disabled=no disconnect-timeout=3s distance=14 frame-lifetime=0 frequency=5580
frequency-mode=manual-txpower frequency-offset=0 hide-ssid=no ht-ampdu-priorities=0 ht-amsdu-limit=8192
ht-amsdu-threshold=8192 ht-basic-mcs=mcs-0,mcs-1,mcs-2,mcs-3,mcs-4,mcs-5,mcs-6,mcs-7 ht-guard-interval=any
ht-rxchains=0,1 ht-supported-mcs=“mcs-0,mcs-1,mcs-2,mcs-3,mcs-4,mcs-5,mcs-6,mcs-7,mcs-8,mcs-9,mcs-10,mcs-11,mcs-12,mc
s-13,mcs-14,mcs-15,mcs-16,mcs-17,mcs-18,mcs-19,mcs-20,mcs-21,mcs-22,mcs-23” ht-txchains=0,1
hw-fragmentation-threshold=disabled hw-protection-mode=none hw-protection-threshold=0 hw-retries=7 l2mtu=2290
mac-address=xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx max-station-count=2007 mode=station-bridge mtu=1500 multicast-helper=default name=
wlan1 noise-floor-threshold=default nv2-cell-radius=30 nv2-noise-floor-offset=default nv2-preshared-key=“” nv2-qos=
default nv2-queue-count=2 nv2-security=disabled on-fail-retry-time=100ms periodic-calibration=default
periodic-calibration-interval=60 preamble-mode=both proprietary-extensions=post-2.9.25 radio-name=xxxxxxxxxxxx
rate-selection=advanced rate-set=default scan-list=default security-profile=default ssid=SOME-LINK
station-bridge-clone-mac=00:00:00:00:00:00 supported-rates-a/g=6Mbps,9Mbps,12Mbps,18Mbps,24Mbps,36Mbps,48Mbps,54Mbps
supported-rates-b=1Mbps,2Mbps,5.5Mbps,11Mbps tdma-period-size=2 tx-power=18 tx-power-mode=card-rates
update-stats-interval=disabled wds-cost-range=50-150 wds-default-bridge=none wds-default-cost=100 wds-ignore-ssid=no
wds-mode=disabled wireless-protocol=nv2-nstreme-802.11 wmm-support=disabled
/interface wireless manual-tx-power-table
set wlan1 manual-tx-powers=“1Mbps:17,2Mbps:17,5.5Mbps:17,11Mbps:17,6Mbps:17,9Mbps:17,12Mbps:17,18Mbps:17,24Mbps:17,36Mbps
:17,48Mbps:17,54Mbps:17,HT20-0:17,HT20-1:17,HT20-2:17,HT20-3:17,HT20-4:17,HT20-5:17,HT20-6:17,HT20-7:17,HT40-0:17,HT4
0-1:17,HT40-2:17,HT40-3:17,HT40-4:17,HT40-5:17,HT40-6:17,HT40-7:17”
/interface wireless nstreme
set wlan1 disable-csma=no enable-nstreme=yes enable-polling=yes framer-limit=3200 framer-policy=none
/interface wireless align
set active-mode=yes audio-max=-20 audio-min=-100 audio-monitor=00:00:00:00:00:00 filter-mac=00:00:00:00:00:00
frame-size=300 frames-per-second=25 receive-all=no ssid-all=no
/interface wireless sniffer
set channel-time=200ms file-limit=10 file-name=“” memory-limit=10 multiple-channels=no only-headers=no receive-errors=no
streaming-enabled=no streaming-max-rate=0 streaming-server=0.0.0.0
/interface wireless snooper
set channel-time=200ms multiple-channels=yes receive-errors=no

Bridge RB711-5HnD conf. :

jan/11/1970 17:00:02 by RouterOS 5.24

software id = *******

/interface wireless security-profiles
set [ find default=yes ] authentication-types=“” eap-methods=passthrough group-ciphers=“” group-key-update=5m
interim-update=0s management-protection=disabled management-protection-key=“” mode=none name=default
radius-eap-accounting=no radius-mac-accounting=no radius-mac-authentication=no radius-mac-caching=disabled
radius-mac-format=XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX radius-mac-mode=as-username static-algo-0=none static-algo-1=none static-algo-2=
none static-algo-3=none static-key-0=“” static-key-1=“” static-key-2=“” static-key-3=“” static-sta-private-algo=none
static-sta-private-key=“” static-transmit-key=key-0 supplicant-identity=MikroTik tls-certificate=none tls-mode=
no-certificates unicast-ciphers=“” wpa-pre-shared-key=“” wpa2-pre-shared-key=“”
/interface wireless
set 0 adaptive-noise-immunity=none allow-sharedkey=no antenna-gain=0 area=“” arp=proxy-arp band=5ghz-a/n
basic-rates-a/g=6Mbps bridge-mode=enabled channel-width=20/40mhz-ht-above compression=no country=croatia
default-ap-tx-limit=0 default-authentication=yes default-client-tx-limit=0 default-forwarding=yes dfs-mode=none
disable-running-check=no disabled=no disconnect-timeout=3s distance=dynamic frame-lifetime=0 frequency=5580
frequency-mode=manual-txpower frequency-offset=0 hide-ssid=no ht-ampdu-priorities=0 ht-amsdu-limit=8192
ht-amsdu-threshold=8192 ht-basic-mcs=mcs-0,mcs-1,mcs-2,mcs-3,mcs-4,mcs-5,mcs-6,mcs-7 ht-guard-interval=any
ht-rxchains=0,1 ht-supported-mcs=“mcs-0,mcs-1,mcs-2,mcs-3,mcs-4,mcs-5,mcs-6,mcs-7,mcs-8,mcs-9,mcs-10,mcs-11,mcs-12,mc
s-13,mcs-14,mcs-15,mcs-16,mcs-17,mcs-18,mcs-19,mcs-20,mcs-21,mcs-22,mcs-23” ht-txchains=0,1
hw-fragmentation-threshold=disabled hw-protection-mode=none hw-protection-threshold=0 hw-retries=7 l2mtu=2290
mac-address=XX:XX:XX:XX:XX:XX max-station-count=2007 mode=bridge mtu=1500 multicast-helper=default name=wlan1
noise-floor-threshold=default nv2-cell-radius=13 nv2-noise-floor-offset=default nv2-preshared-key=“” nv2-qos=default
nv2-queue-count=2 nv2-security=disabled on-fail-retry-time=100ms periodic-calibration=default
periodic-calibration-interval=60 preamble-mode=both proprietary-extensions=post-2.9.25 radio-name=XXXXXXXXXX
rate-selection=advanced rate-set=default scan-list=default security-profile=default ssid=SOME-LINK
station-bridge-clone-mac=00:00:00:00:00:00 supported-rates-a/g=6Mbps,9Mbps,12Mbps,18Mbps,24Mbps,36Mbps,48Mbps,54Mbps
tdma-period-size=3 tx-power=22 tx-power-mode=card-rates update-stats-interval=disabled wds-cost-range=50-150
wds-default-bridge=none wds-default-cost=100 wds-ignore-ssid=no wds-mode=disabled wireless-protocol=nstreme
wmm-support=disabled
/interface wireless manual-tx-power-table
set wlan1 manual-tx-powers=“1Mbps:17,2Mbps:17,5.5Mbps:17,11Mbps:17,6Mbps:17,9Mbps:17,12Mbps:17,18Mbps:17,24Mbps:17,36Mbps
:17,48Mbps:17,54Mbps:17,HT20-0:17,HT20-1:17,HT20-2:17,HT20-3:17,HT20-4:17,HT20-5:17,HT20-6:17,HT20-7:17,HT40-0:17,HT4
0-1:17,HT40-2:17,HT40-3:17,HT40-4:17,HT40-5:17,HT40-6:17,HT40-7:17”
/interface wireless nstreme
set wlan1 disable-csma=no enable-nstreme=yes enable-polling=yes framer-limit=3200 framer-policy=best-fit
/interface wireless align
set active-mode=yes audio-max=-20 audio-min=-100 audio-monitor=00:00:00:00:00:00 filter-mac=00:00:00:00:00:00
frame-size=300 frames-per-second=25 receive-all=no ssid-all=no
/interface wireless sniffer
set channel-time=200ms file-limit=10 file-name=“” memory-limit=10 multiple-channels=no only-headers=no receive-errors=no
streaming-enabled=no streaming-max-rate=0 streaming-server=0.0.0.0
/interface wireless snooper
set channel-time=200ms multiple-channels=yes receive-errors=no

[Robinson]

It would be good if someone from Mikrotik offer a solution for this general problem.
Or just prompt answers on support.
When our users is dissatisfied then there is no time for waiting.. How do we explain them that connection is drop but we don’t now how?

In my case link work stable until we update routers with some of new version of RoS. We can not exactly say which version, because it’s been a while since first user reports a problems.

Did someone noticed which version works OK on 802.11n and 2*2 MIMO??

[dada]

@Robinson

In my case link work stable until we update routers with some of new version of RoS. We can not exactly say which version, because it’s been a while since first user reports a problems.

Did someone noticed which version works OK on 802.11n and 2*2 MIMO??

on our local ISP forum somebody said that 5.14 is the version…

[Robinson]

@dada

@Robinson

In my case link work stable until we update routers with some of new version of RoS. We can not exactly say which version, because it's been a while since first user reports a problems.

Did someone noticed which version works OK on 802.11n and 2*2 MIMO??

on our local ISP forum somebody said that 5.14 is the version...

Now I'm looking other PtP link ver. 5.20, nstreme, 2*2MIMO 802,11n link active 5 days. Not the best, but ok :-/

INTERFACE RADIO-NAME MAC-ADDRESS AP SIGNAL-STRENGTH TX-RATE UPTIME

0 wlan1 000------------ xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx yes -64dBm@6Mbps 117.... 5d15h37m47s

EDIT:

Tested that link works stable with nv2 802.11n 2*2 MIMO, but ping :-/ 4-10 ms. I must temp. use that config to hawe stable connection

[mperdue]

You know what drives me crazy? After reading this? I can only get N-stream 2xmimo links to work. Nv2 will not stay connected. Using 6.1. RB711 with the built in radio’s.
(on any of my 14 5.8Mhz point to point links)
-Michael

[marcin21]

hmm, i just wanted to confirm 5.14 to be the right version having in mind one of my rb433
that because of nice uptime I didn’t upgraded. It’s right now running nstreme
link uptime 43d15h, 100/100ccq, latency 0/0/2 ms in kind of noisy environment! but what
astonished me that it’s 4.14 ROS
Back to the first steps in 802.11n i had long long working ( 1,5year ) link in nstreme 2x2 with ROS 4.3,
just when i started to play with new releases i’ve never get back the stability of 4.3.
maybe unroll some changes in driver and gain at least temporary solution.

[honzam]

From ROS 6.7 it works. Uptime 32days and no dissconnect

[SalimLeb]

I have the latest ROS verion 6.21rc8 and I have the same issue. trying all recommendation by mikrotik support, but still have the same problems,
The link performance is more than the expectation, but it drops or have low data rate frequently.
Mikrotik recommend to enable wireless FP package, reset resting and reconfigure, upgrade to the latest test version of ROS.. nothing solve the problem.

note that after upgrading to the latest version, now I have no logs with the error I have before the upgrade such as (management protection failure. / ether1 link down, ether1 link up. / no network that satisfies connect-list, by default choose with strongest signal. / failed to select netwrok. / delaying scanning… must select a netwok… empty. / wlan1: failed to set bridge port for wlan1, reason: device already added as bridge port (6)…

Now I don’t have any of these logs, but the same problem with the same occurrence frequency.
restarting the one of the RB was solving the problem when the link drops.

after upgrading the link doesn’t drop, but it have very low performance most of the time..

[und3ath]

@SalimLeb

I have the latest ROS verion 6.21rc8 and I have the same issue. trying all recommendation by mikrotik support, but still have the same problems,
The link performance is more than the expectation, but it drops or have low data rate frequently.
Mikrotik recommend to enable wireless FP package, reset resting and reconfigure, upgrade to the latest test version of ROS.. nothing solve the problem.

note that after upgrading to the latest version, now I have no logs with the error I have before the upgrade such as (management protection failure. / ether1 link down, ether1 link up. / no network that satisfies connect-list, by default choose with strongest signal. / failed to select netwrok. / delaying scanning… must select a netwok… empty. / wlan1: failed to set bridge port for wlan1, reason: device already added as bridge port (6)…

Now I don’t have any of these logs, but the same problem with the same occurrence frequency.
restarting the one of the RB was solving the problem when the link drops.

after upgrading the link doesn’t drop, but it have very low performance most of the time..

What are your signal levels?
I have these same problem, but I found out that when I have signal better than -55dBm (cca), eveyrthing works ok.

[honzam]

For test, can you try ROS 6.7?

[SalimLeb]

Reading in the forum and other forums.. I found that NV2 may solve the problem. but if you are using he NV2 and you have the problem.. so it’s not the solution.

here is what I found:
The key differences between Nv2 and Nstreme:
Reduced polling overhead - instead of polling each client, Nv2 AP broadcasts uplink schedule that assigns time to multiple clients, this can be considered “group polling” - no time is wasted for polling each client individually, leaving more time for actual data transmission. This improves throughput, especially in PtMP configurations.

I’m currently using Nstreme!
Any recommendation from NV2 users?

[kapulan]

@honzam

For test, can you try ROS 6.7?

Hi !

Are use only 2x2 or 1x1 chain ? My test resolution 1x1 work fine nstream on 64QAM modulation , but change the settings to dual chain random disconnection and slow speed !

[honzam]

@kapulan

@honzam

For test, can you try ROS 6.7?

Hi !
Are use only 2x2 or 1x1 chain ? My test resolution 1x1 work fine nstream on 64QAM modulation , but change the settings to dual chain random disconnection and slow speed !

After 6.7 we have no problem with 2x2 nstream. This is P2P link. 2x2, hw retries 15, 2,3km distance.
No problem with speed and disconnect. Works well from 6.7. Now with 6.18. Uptime is only 9days because - power outage

[lucky79]

@honzam

@kapulan

@honzam

For test, can you try ROS 6.7?

Hi !
Are use only 2x2 or 1x1 chain ? My test resolution 1x1 work fine nstream on 64QAM modulation , but change the settings to dual chain random disconnection and slow speed !

After 6.7 we have no problem with 2x2 nstream. This is P2P link. 2x2, hw retries 15, 2,3km distance.
No problem with speed and disconnect. Works well from 6.7. Now with 6.18. Uptime is only 9days because - power outage

Are you using wireless or wireless-fp?

Thanks

[kapulan]

@honzam

@kapulan

@honzam

For test, can you try ROS 6.7?

Hi !
Are use only 2x2 or 1x1 chain ? My test resolution 1x1 work fine nstream on 64QAM modulation , but change the settings to dual chain random disconnection and slow speed !

After 6.7 we have no problem with 2x2 nstream. This is P2P link. 2x2, hw retries 15, 2,3km distance.
No problem with speed and disconnect. Works well from 6.7. Now with 6.18. Uptime is only 9days because - power outage

And the speed udp or tcp ?

Thank you.