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albercik
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CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:33 pm

Hello All!

I have a CRS109-8G-1S-2HnD router at my office. A router was working fine until few months ago it became to crash/restart itself. It happend once per few days so I didn't gave it much attention, as I'm quite busy man ;)

But now - it's a horror. The router reboots itself from few times a day for few times a minute. It's almost impossible to work on it. What's odd - after reboot, the clock on MT changes randomly (it can go back few minutes, hours, days or years - without any pattern on that).

The only entry in log is that the router was rebooted without proper shutdown. I've found a similar problem described here, on the Forum, and the solution was to upgrade the router's software. We'll - I'm wiling to give it a shot, but first - I want to ask you few things:

My current RouterOS is 6.27. It's quite old. Is it safe to perform an upgrade to current stable version (6.43.8)? Or do I need to perform some upgrade path from less recent version until a current one?

Another question is will the upgrade hold my configuration or will i have to recover it from scratch (as probably the backup from old firmware won't be readable for newer one)?

And the last thing - if the answer for previous question is 'yes - it will keep current config' - is it safe to perform the upgrade remotely (as nobody works in the office - everyone's in field)?

Thank you in advance and best regards
Tom
 
mkx
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:47 pm

You can perform upgrade directly. However it is advisable to perform upgrade to 6.40.9 (fetch it from download archive). Only after that upgrade to latest long-term (6.42.11) or stable (6.43.8 ). BTW, don't forget to upgrade routerboot firmware (/system routerboard upgrade) after every newer version of ROS boots up.

Before you do upgrades, create (and save off device) fresh backup file and configuration export (using /export file=export.rsc). The later is text file, which can be used as a guideline if you have to re-do the configuration. It's not replacement for backup file, it doesn't contain some things, e.g. certificates, private keys, passwords, etc.

Upgrades hold configuration, but upgrade from 6.40 to 6.41 will change the way ethernet ports are handled (previously there was master-port, now it's all off a bridge). If old configuration is not quite straight-forward, then upgrade magic might mess things up.

Personally I wouldn't upgrade device remotely if such a large version difference is in play.

One final note: sometimes devices start to behave weirdly and upgrade of ROS and routerboot doesn't help. There were reports that ROS installation from scratch (i.e. netinstall) helps. This process should definitely not be performed remotely (even if it somehow works) as the process is very fragile and device, if netinstall is not carefully mastered, starts with blank config initially.
BR,
Metod
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:54 am

Thank you for the reply.

Please, forget I've ever asked for remote upgrade ;)

but upgrade from 6.40 to 6.41 will change the way ethernet ports are handled (previously there was master-port, now it's all off a bridge). If old configuration is not quite straight-forward, then upgrade magic might mess things up.

And here I smell some problem.

My configuration is that I have to networks (10.0.x.x and 10.1.x.x) - one is for work, and the other one is for guests. I have a PPTP VPN server running. And that was the easy part. The problem is that I have another MT (RB750) at my DC with Site-to-Site tunnel over PPTP and WHOLE TRAFFIC is directed from DC to the tunnel, so e.g. my Exchange Server at DC talks to the World using my office's IP address. Also my webpages and other services are redircted over my office's IP address. NAT rules list in firewall is long as toilet paper roll...

sometimes devices start to behave weirdly and upgrade of ROS and routerboot doesn't help. There were reports that ROS installation from scratch (i.e. netinstall) helps.

And this is what bothers me most. I have to schedule some downtime for all of the company's services, perform an upgrade and pray it will solve the problem. The praying part will be the hardest for me :twisted:
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:40 pm

Okay. I've made upgrades following your guidelines. Now I'm running RouterOS 6.42.11. None of the settings were lost nor needed to be updated :) Let me say - this was the easiest upgrade I've ever made on any electronic device :)

But... Before making this upgrade I've made another observation: when my phones are turned off and my laptop is docked (networ connection via ethernet port) - everything works seamlessly. I've transferred over 10GB of data and nothing happened. As soon as I've turned on my phone and played some video on YT - the router rebooted. Next test: I've downloaded (to be honest - I've tried to download) some large file over WiFi from my laptop - router rebooted again. I've switched off my phone, connected laptop to docking station and voila! Router works fine without reboots...

But let me check it after ROS upgrade.

BTW - my CRS has configured two SSID's (one is regular AP, the other one is virtual AP) with two different subnets assigned.
 
mkx
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:28 pm

Router shouldn't restart just like that even if there's some misconfiguration in the mix. However, 6.27 you were running previously was a quite old release and some stability fixes might be implemented meanwhile.
If your CRS keeps misbehaving, you might want to post full configuration (output of /export hide-sensitive) for us to comment on it ...
BR,
Metod
 
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:21 pm

...
But... Before making this upgrade I've made another observation: when my phones are turned off and my laptop is docked (networ connection via ethernet port) - everything works seamlessly. I've transferred over 10GB of data and nothing happened. As soon as I've turned on my phone and played some video on YT - the router rebooted. Next test: I've downloaded (to be honest - I've tried to download) some large file over WiFi from my laptop - router rebooted again. I've switched off my phone, connected laptop to docking station and voila! Router works fine without reboots...
...

Check your power supply / adapter.
Had the same issue at a client with RB2011, but the client had a 12V power adapter to provide power to device, as soon as you start using wifi, it reboots.
Changed the PSU / Adapter to 24V, 1,2A adapter, and voila, problem solved.
MTCNA, MTCTCE, MTCRE & MTCINE
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:05 pm

...
But... Before making this upgrade I've made another observation: when my phones are turned off and my laptop is docked (networ connection via ethernet port) - everything works seamlessly. I've transferred over 10GB of data and nothing happened. As soon as I've turned on my phone and played some video on YT - the router rebooted. Next test: I've downloaded (to be honest - I've tried to download) some large file over WiFi from my laptop - router rebooted again. I've switched off my phone, connected laptop to docking station and voila! Router works fine without reboots...
...

Check your power supply / adapter.
Had the same issue at a client with RB2011, but the client had a 12V power adapter to provide power to device, as soon as you start using wifi, it reboots.
Changed the PSU / Adapter to 24V, 1,2A adapter, and voila, problem solved.
Hmm, maybe but... It used to work for almost two years without any problem. Standard 12V 1.5A adapter. I've heard some bad things about faulty adapters so I've replaced it to new one 12V 2A. Nothing changed.

After updating a software and firmware - nothing changed. I've performed some more tests: I've set-up new (independent) router with AP and disabled the WiFi interface in MikroTik - the router works as brand new. As soon as I've turned the interface on and connected my phone - router crashed.

So there must be something wrong with WiFi obviously. But I have no idea how to verify if it's hardware fault, or logic...
 
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:12 pm

...
But... Before making this upgrade I've made another observation: when my phones are turned off and my laptop is docked (networ connection via ethernet port) - everything works seamlessly. I've transferred over 10GB of data and nothing happened. As soon as I've turned on my phone and played some video on YT - the router rebooted. Next test: I've downloaded (to be honest - I've tried to download) some large file over WiFi from my laptop - router rebooted again. I've switched off my phone, connected laptop to docking station and voila! Router works fine without reboots...
...

Check your power supply / adapter.
Had the same issue at a client with RB2011, but the client had a 12V power adapter to provide power to device, as soon as you start using wifi, it reboots.
Changed the PSU / Adapter to 24V, 1,2A adapter, and voila, problem solved.
Hmm, maybe but... It used to work for almost two years without any problem. Standard 12V 1.5A adapter. I've heard some bad things about faulty adapters so I've replaced it to new one 12V 2A. Nothing changed.

After updating a software and firmware - nothing changed. I've performed some more tests: I've set-up new (independent) router with AP and disabled the WiFi interface in MikroTik - the router works as brand new. As soon as I've turned the interface on and connected my phone - router crashed.

So there must be something wrong with WiFi obviously. But I have no idea how to verify if it's hardware fault, or logic...

But the device comes standard with a 24V 0.8A adapter???
https://mikrotik.com/product/CRS109-8G-1S-2HnD-IN
MTCNA, MTCTCE, MTCRE & MTCINE
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Tue Feb 12, 2019 7:45 pm


But the device comes standard with a 24V 0.8A adapter???
https://mikrotik.com/product/CRS109-8G-1S-2HnD-IN
yes, I'm aware of that, but I'd bought this MT second-hand as I had low on-start-budget and I didn't know if it will fit my needs (turned out MT rocks ;) ). It came with 12V DC adapter and it was working fine so I didn't care much.

Now, when I've disabled WiFi on it and used external AP (some Asus RP-N12 that I've found in my desk) - it works flawlessly. No reboots/crashes etc.

I'm now confused a'bit what to do next:
- buy new MT RB2011UIAS-2HND-IN
or
- buy new MT AP RBcAPL-2nD

I need two seperate SSID's with two different subnets (10.0.x.x & 10.1.x.x) and to control all the traffic on my router's firewall.
 
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:02 pm

Yes, the wireless radios draw quit a bit of power.

It sounds as if the CRS109 meets your requirements, if that is the case, and it was me, I will buy the correct power supply, add a virtual WLan and voila, you have 2 x SSIDs
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albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:23 am

Yes, the wireless radios draw quit a bit of power.

It sounds as if the CRS109 meets your requirements, if that is the case, and it was me, I will buy the correct power supply, add a virtual WLan and voila, you have 2 x SSIDs
Yes indeed - CRS109 fits my need perfectly :) I've made a lot of customization to it including a script that checks if my servers are running correctly and if not - sends me a SMS alert ;)

I have already had a two wireless AP's (master and virtual) and it was working fine. I'll try to buy 24V/2A power supply.

BTW - I've heard that CRS109 can be powered on ETH0 using PoE. Is that a thruth? I have some PoE power supply in my basement...
 
mkx
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:47 am

BTW - I've heard that CRS109 can be powered on ETH0 using PoE. Is that a thruth? I have some PoE power supply in my basement...

According to specifications that's true. But ... it's not standard PoE (is in 802.3af/at), it's passive. So it's quite possible your PoE power supply wouldn't do it (there are a few different 'passive' PoE implementations, but typically they are not compatible between different vendors).
BR,
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albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:09 am

BTW - I've heard that CRS109 can be powered on ETH0 using PoE. Is that a thruth? I have some PoE power supply in my basement...

According to specifications that's true. But ... it's not standard PoE (is in 802.3af/at), it's passive. So it's quite possible your PoE power supply wouldn't do it (there are a few different 'passive' PoE implementations, but typically they are not compatible between different vendors).
Ok. So I'll look for another power supply then. Thank you for all the advices.

I'll keep you posted.
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:23 pm

So far, so good. Since disabling a wifi interfaces - no reboots, no crashes, works as desired.

I definitly need to buy a replacement adapter.
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Feb 20, 2019 1:25 pm

Ok, I've been looking for some DC adapter. And I'm confused a little bit.

Basically, there two types of adapters: impulse and transforming. Which one should I choose for my MT?
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:03 am

Okay. So I've made some reserach. As I didn't wanted to waste my money on a DC adapter in case it wasn't an issue - I've used an 19V, 3.8A DC adapter coming from some old ASUS notebook. MT is working flawlessly without any restarts or crashes with WiFi radio turned on. I've tranasferred almost 200GB over WiFi and it's working good.

So, obviously, I need to by a original DC adapter.

Thank you guys for the advice and best regards!
Tom
 
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Sun Mar 17, 2019 12:21 pm

If the old 19V adapter works fine and you don't need it for anything else, I don't see why you need to change that.
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:23 pm

It's because the connector is slightly different than it should be. MT uses a standard DC jack 5.5/2.5 mm and the adapter uses 5.5/2.1 mm and it doesn't stay tight. Even a smaller move causes shutdown and reboot.

However.... I now have a brand new RB2011UiAS (without WiFi radio) and new RBcAPL-2nD (a customer ordered but never collected) so I think I'm gonna switch to it. At least - I'll have 1Gbps transfer (which will make a difference as I have a 300Mbps link) and I'll be able to put the AP in the middle of the room, so it will cover whole space with outter rooms (at the moment the router is located in the corner and I have a range issues at the opposite corner).

CRS109 will go to my summer house combined with a LTE-to-ETH bridge will provide me a reliable Internet while relaxing ;)
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:07 pm

Strange,

Before I even had a chance to move my config from old HW to new one - the CRS started to reboot again.

I suppose it's a hardware malfunction :(

Is there any place I can find a schematics/diagram of routerboard for this model? I'd like to perform some checks as I think that it's a faulty capacitor or resistor...
 
albercik
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Re: CRS109-8G Crashes/reboots often

Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:11 pm

Okay, I think I've figured it out.

I wanted to test my CRS109 if it will work with LTE USB dongle. But it couldn't find it. So I've removed a device's cover and it turned out that somebody was trying to repair a USB port on RB. It has traces of ironing and whole usb connector is broken. Also, there's been some damage made to RB itself.

I guess this is the cause of all of my problems with the device.

Currently - I'll try to set it up in my summer house and - maybe - it will still work only for the weekends. If yes - great. If not - well, I'll need to utilize it and buy something else. Probably RB750UP and two cAP's.

Thank you all for your advices!

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