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surinameclubcard
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Spontaneous reboots

Fri Mar 20, 2020 2:44 pm

Hi,

First post.

I've been running a RB4011 for a while now and I'm suffering from spontaneous reboots. I've had 3 in 4 weeks. The log always shows "Topics: system, error, critical, Message: router was rebooted without proper shutdown".

The router itself isn't doing anything spectacular. Just some standard stuff like Wifi + guest Wifi, couple of VLANs, simple firewall rules and a bit of queueing. Board identifies itself as RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD, running version 6.46.4 (stable). Hardly any visible CPU load and lots of free memory. Haven't upgraded the Routerboard firmware yet (current firmware is 6.45.1, upgrade firmware 6.46.4).

I have enabled remote logging and I noticed that around the moment of the "crash", the time of the router seems to have changed abnormally. Just before the crash, last message sent had timestamp "04:01:32", right after the "crash"/reboot, the next message had timestamp "03:52:55".

Could NTP be a factor? I'm not using (S)NTP but the Cloud feature.

What is the best approach to fight this?

Tnx!
 
hschnei
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Fri Mar 20, 2020 4:23 pm

Same here with a RB4011iGS+RM.
Tried with different RouterOS versions all the way to the latest beta.
Changed power supplies and everything is running of a UPS anyway.
Still reboots every few days.
Best advice is to open a support case.
Send my RB4001 back for RMA warranty repair and waiting for the
return or exchange.

Greetings
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sat Mar 21, 2020 9:57 pm

Same here with a RB4011iGS+RM.
[...]
Best advice is to open a support case.
Thank you for your reply! Did support say it is a hardware problem?
 
hschnei
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun Mar 22, 2020 1:46 pm

Mikrotik support first wanted me to try the latest RouterOS beta
and then told me to open a RMA warranty repair with
my distributor. They did not say if this is software or
hardware related. Looking at the other RB4011 cases
on this forum viewtopic.php?f=2&t=149062
I think iit is a hardware issue after all.

Greetings
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun Mar 22, 2020 5:19 pm

Yeah but that post is from June 2019, you'd expect that not to be a problem in March 2020 anymore, do you?
 
r00t
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun Mar 22, 2020 7:51 pm

It might be hardware issue, software issue or a combination of both... no one knows, Mikrotik isn't telling us any details either. Sadly this is "business as usual" here. Some products are clear "lemons"... never ending RB4011 issues, flapping ports on RB3011, ... only "fix" is to get rid of the device while you still can by RMAing it with your supplier.
 
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun Mar 22, 2020 9:58 pm

It might be hardware issue, software issue or a combination of both... no one knows, Mikrotik isn't telling us any details either. Sadly this is "business as usual" here. Some products are clear "lemons"... never ending RB4011 issues, flapping ports on RB3011, ... only "fix" is to get rid of the device while you still can by RMAing it with your supplier.
That isn't great publicity for Mikrotik at all! Anyone from Mikrotik cares to respond? This cannot be true, can it?
 
complex1
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:48 pm

Hi,

I have exactly the same issue.
Within say 7 days my RB4011 suddenly reboot, out of the blue.
After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
I try as workaround and I don't know why I do it, let say a shot in the dark, but I have disable the 5GHz Wifi to see if the reboots disappears.
Kind regards,
Frank.
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Tue Mar 24, 2020 5:36 pm

I have exactly the same issue. Within say 7 days my RB4011 suddenly reboot, out of the blue. After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
I try as workaround and I don't know why I do it, let say a shot in the dark, but I have disable the 5GHz Wifi to see if the reboots disappears.
Ok. I did not touch 5Ghz but completely disabled time-management. So no (S)NTP and no "IP->Cloud->Update Time". 6 days < uptime < 7 days now. Looking at the date/time, they are still correct.
 
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mutluit
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Wed Mar 25, 2020 4:18 am

I have exactly the same issue. Within say 7 days my RB4011 suddenly reboot, out of the blue. After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
I try as workaround and I don't know why I do it, let say a shot in the dark, but I have disable the 5GHz Wifi to see if the reboots disappears.
Ok. I did not touch 5Ghz but completely disabled time-management. So no (S)NTP and no "IP->Cloud->Update Time". 6 days < uptime < 7 days now. Looking at the date/time, they are still correct.
Hi, what do you mean with "5Ghz"? I was thinking the RB4011iGS+RM does not have any WLAN, right? Or do you mean a different device?
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:56 pm

I'm the OP; I just wanted to say that after disabling all "remote" Mikrotik time management ('/IP/Cloud/Update Time' disabled and '/System/SNTP' disabled), I haven't had a spontaneous reboot anymore.

Even Daylight Saving Time was applied by the device itself last weekend, also not leading to any problems. Clock seems to be off by approximately 2 seconds now. Not a problem for me but YMMV.

@Mikrotik, are you here? I this just coincidence or is the root cause?
 
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macsrwe
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:11 pm

Lots of reports of NTP package causing reboots in recent releases, this may be your only problem.

MikroTik is not guaranteed to be here. To assure MikroTik attention, email bug report to support@mikrotik.com.
 
Beone
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sat May 02, 2020 1:07 pm

we have +160 rb4011 devices having crash issues, opened cases, they told us to RMA due to hardware issue.

distributor cant see problem and rejects RMA...
even new latest serial numbers crashing, up until v6.47beta54 where we suddenly have longer uptimes then 7 days...
 
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sat May 02, 2020 3:43 pm

We have some RB4011 running but never any problem. They are also running with the NTP Server. At the moment 96 days uptime.

Image
 
hschnei
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun May 03, 2020 12:54 pm

From my experience it is not the NTP server but the SNTP client
causing the reboots. Disabling the SNTP client solved it for me
so far. (>20 days).
 
chrisub
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun May 03, 2020 1:44 pm

I have disabled "SNTP Client" and "Time update" in Cloud settings, but reboots still occurs. One time it happened exactly when I was connecting my phone to WiFi (maybe coincidence?).
Last edited by chrisub on Sun May 03, 2020 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun May 03, 2020 1:53 pm

From my experience it is not the NTP server but the SNTP client
causing the reboots. Disabling the SNTP client solved it for me
so far. (>20 days).
Correct, it is not the NTP server but the NTP client that is causing the problem.
 
Kampfwurst
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Sun May 03, 2020 2:02 pm

On all off my routers is also the ntp client running without problems
 
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antoxic
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Mon May 11, 2020 12:35 am

Hi!

I’m also suffering the unexpected reboots! Sometimes after a week, sometimes after a day. It happens even with absolutely no load. It’s so frustrating. After the reboot there is no supoort.inf file. I’m running 6.46.5 and the routerboard is updated. I’ve tried the stock power supply, one with 48v and another with 57v. No luck.

Edit: I’m using RB4011iGS+5HacQ2HnD

Is there any official answer?

Regards
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Mon May 11, 2020 9:39 pm

I’m also suffering the unexpected reboots! Sometimes after a week, sometimes after a day. It happens even with absolutely no load. It’s so frustrating. After the reboot there is no supoort.inf file. I’m running 6.46.5 and the routerboard is updated. I’ve tried the stock power supply, one with 48v and another with 57v. No luck.
Try disabling time management as is mentioned in this thread. I haven't had reboots anymore since disabling it. Router is up for 45 days now.
 
pe1chl
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Mon May 11, 2020 10:25 pm

After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
That is actually completely normal for any reboot caused by a crash or power-fail! (on a MikroTik device)
These routers do not have a realtime clock chip. They save the current time in the flash memory once every couple of hours, and when the
router is booted, it starts the software clock (maintained by timer interrupts) from the last saved value. Then it attempts to update the clock
via one of the possible mechanisms (cloud time, SNTP, NTP) and before that has happened you will see log messages in the past.
Once the correct time is retrieved the log message time will change to the correct value.

This phenomenon only proves that the reboot was caused by a crash or power-fail, not that the crash was anyway related to the handling of time.
When the router is rebooted using a /system reboot (or similar GUI command) the saving of the current time to flash memory happens just
before the reboot and the difference in time is only about half a minute, which often goes unnoticed. When it is caused by a crash the
difference can be several hours and is easier to notice.
 
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antoxic
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Tue May 12, 2020 4:06 pm

After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
That is actually completely normal for any reboot caused by a crash or power-fail! (on a MikroTik device)
These routers do not have a realtime clock chip. They save the current time in the flash memory once every couple of hours, and when the
router is booted, it starts the software clock (maintained by timer interrupts) from the last saved value. Then it attempts to update the clock
via one of the possible mechanisms (cloud time, SNTP, NTP) and before that has happened you will see log messages in the past.
Once the correct time is retrieved the log message time will change to the correct value.

This phenomenon only proves that the reboot was caused by a crash or power-fail, not that the crash was anyway related to the handling of time.
When the router is rebooted using a /system reboot (or similar GUI command) the saving of the current time to flash memory happens just
before the reboot and the difference in time is only about half a minute, which often goes unnoticed. When it is caused by a crash the
difference can be several hours and is easier to notice.
Thank you, I will send them the file generated with your script.
 
surinameclubcard
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Re: Spontaneous reboots

Tue May 12, 2020 6:17 pm

After rebooting the time is always different from what is was.
That is actually completely normal for any reboot caused by a crash or power-fail! (on a MikroTik device)
Thank you for your insights. In that case, the fact that the time differs after a restart is to be expected. Yet, it then is a coincidence that the cause seems to be time (Cloud, NTP, SNTP) related. Or related to an generic/shared function underneath it.

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