Up till recently, it's correct that for a pure access-point Ubiquiti had some interesting offers Mikrotik could not directly match.I found plenty of recommendations in the internet to "buy MikroTik router and few UBNT APs". Why is that? Is it some super nice couple that works great or MT doesn't have equivalent product to ubnt? Or Unifi APs are somehow super awesome, better than ones MT offers?
I probably would try to keep single manufacturer in network, so why to mix UBNT with MT?
the differences between tx power and rx sensitivity are well referenced on datasheets:
I bought hAP lite recently as second AP but unfortunately it doesn't seem to have really powerfull radio . Or at least it's completely smashed by RB. I mean currently RB2011 has stronger signal at any distance above like 2-3m from hAP so hAP provides rather negligible coverage. Considering crowded block of flats it's quite useless.
This is a very wrong assumption. For the best performance (both up- and download) you need that both your AP and your smartphone/laptop/tablet/whatever have comparable tx power. Higher tx power is of no use indoors, if you need better coverage the only way to go is adding additional APs.keep in mind most smartphones operate at 10-16dbm tx power then using and ap at very high tx power can help to improve downloading data-rates but the upload data-rate is determined by client device tx power and AP rx sensitivity.
This is a very wrong assumption. For the best performance (both up- and download) you need that both your AP and your smartphone/laptop/tablet/whatever have comparable tx power. Higher tx power is of no use indoors, if you need better coverage the only way to go is adding additional APs.keep in mind most smartphones operate at 10-16dbm tx power then using and ap at very high tx power can help to improve downloading data-rates but the upload data-rate is determined by client device tx power and AP rx sensitivity.
Is it? I mean, maybe I'm comparing wrong products but to me prices of outdoor are quite similar. But I don't really know much about outdoor so I can't really tell if UBNT is more affordable.the other reason is cost. Mikrotik outdoor APs are more expensive than ubiquiti's but at the very least all mikrotik hardware run the same OS whereas ubiquiti's products sometimes have a software flaw or some flaw that doesnt make them great for some situations.
I experience the same with indoor APs. I've been replacing RB751Ui-2HnD APs with 2 or 3 hAP Lites and the results are much better especially in offices where there are a lot of walls/partitions. hAP Lites are very economical. Definitely getting much better user experience.you have reason, the better and good practice for indoor wifi is to use low power and more AP's to increase capacity and give good performance, but is a frequent practice by many many people to increase TX power on AP trying to solve some kind of problem.
In much cases increasing tx power can improve a little the situation because the download data-rate increases in some cases improving performance
off course if upload data-rate is as bad to disconnect the client or insufficient to return the ack's to the AP, increasing tx power on AP do not solve the problem
How? You mean performance wise? Recently ROS moved to hw accelerated bridging from switch master port. Also there's fastpath and fasttrack. Feature wise there's full L3 firewall on bridge level which is life saver for me. Is there some magical feature that you find really useful in UBNT?My 2 cents... For some reason, i found that UBNT devices do a better job at bridging. So that makes it for me, 2 ubnt devices for link, Mtik Routers at the endpoints.
Really?I've chosen Unifi APs (first LR and then later AC Pro) primary for their looks when mounted on the wall. cAPs and wAPs are just ugly.
And sadly, MT has nothing to offer on the PoE switch side that comes near to ES and US (yet, I hope)...
But they are 2,4GHz only. Why not use the same external box, and stick a wAP AC (or its sucessor) inside?Really?I've chosen Unifi APs (first LR and then later AC Pro) primary for their looks when mounted on the wall. cAPs and wAPs are just ugly.
And sadly, MT has nothing to offer on the PoE switch side that comes near to ES and US (yet, I hope)...
I think series of recently released products (and I'm not talking last few months but last few years) kinda draws line where is mtk focus. And "office" devices don't seem to be that. cAP and wAP seem to be only filler in offer for those who want to go full mikrotik. But general focus seems to be on backbone/core/edge networking - wired routers, switches, wireless point-to-point/CPE etc. Wireless in AP sense seems to be additional feature of mtk while UBNT is built around it from ground up. In their case wired networking is kind of "filler" because from what I've seen so far edge router series is meh and unifi SWG, especially XG model, as well as their absolutely unjustified shift into making... servers??? (with freaking Ubuntu, why am I not surprised lmao) and damn LED lighting (seriously? No, really...) kind of shows me that they have no fuckin idea what they're doing in this field. It looks like hardware targeted for people with Apple-like mind share who just bought APs and got astonished by how you can do everything with one button which costs only half of hidney so now they want to go full UBNT just because matte aluminum looks sooo 1337 in rack... Unfortunately YouTube shows that there's a lot of people like that (and yes they legitimately bring up argument that it looks good in rack) but on the other hand it may be just that this kind of people is more likely to upload videos on YT...Where does this stand now in 2019 after an entire 2018?
Don't get the angryness of these posts. Every vendor has limited resources and focus on stuff they see their market. Take the best of every vendor to build your network. I am not from US but I like their approach to praise the goodies and don't keep on blaming stuff that is not good.Indoor:
UniFi performs better than Capsman
UniFi Devices had better Range than WAPac and CAPac
Outdoor:
Mikrotik with ARM Based Chipset is completely unusable, unstable Connections, ping lags, disconnects, TDMA not working with ARM, no Spectral Scan
AirMax and other like Mimosa are miles away
With Spectral Scan you easily finds the best channel, or see the reason for bad speeds
TDMA working with good speeds an jitter free transfer for voip
Smal channel sizes like 10mhz are Optimum for Backup links for a 60Ghz Mikrotik link
They don’t care about the needs so we don’t buy it anymore for Wireless!
I feel like there's been no real progress since the original hAP AC release. I'm still using wAP AC units when I need a small cheap AP and don't care about latency, but for any big deployment I'm going with UBNT / Ruckus depending on budget.Where does this stand now in 2019 after an entire 2018?
People are mad because they feel that something has been taken away from them. Older products didn't have issues with NV2 or TDMS etc., only new ARM devices are problematic from what I've seen so far. It's the same way I'm totally mad about RB4011 because it's hugely disappointing device in my opinion that is not actual RB2011/RB3011 successor since they took away a lot of features that were present in RB2011/RB3011. At this point fact that it has superior performance is less relevant than fact that it's missing features. Pretty much like ARM devices. Nobody cares that they perform better if they have inferior feature set.Don't get the angryness of these posts. Every vendor has limited resources and focus on stuff they see their market. Take the best of every vendor to build your network. I am not from US but I like their approach to praise the goodies and don't keep on blaming stuff that is not good.
MT has a lot of very good stuff to buy and a lot of stuff I don't buy. UBNT/Mimosa/Cambium has stuff I buy and stuff I don't buy.
TBH, I absolutely love to work on the EdgeRouter's CLI, rarely look at the GUI at all. It's a Linux that you can script to your liking. It also has a feature (not out of the box but easily added) to forward broadcasts on certain ports into different subnets. This was a life saver for my home install. AFAIK this can not be added to ROS.what I've seen so far edge router series is meh
Do all people asking for new kernel realize that it would mean dropping support for WHOLE current CCR series since Linux kernel officially dropped support for Tile-Gx CPUs architecture? While I'm not saying Tile-Gx is awesome it'd still mean dropping support for devices that are:My 2 cents...
I choose Mikrotik:
- For routing when high performance-to-price ratio and advanced features are needed.
- When configuration by the user is not required.
- For the power of winbox.
- For Wireless when MkTik routers are also in use and vendor standardization is important.
- For the really good online documentation (which can always become better).
- Because it is a European company, which pioneered in and still leads the "SOHO router" market space, it has less access to its US-based counterparts and for me, it is important to support them.
What I wish Mikrotik did differently:
- Put more care into their wireless products. After all, this is where they started from. Better noise filtering, TDMA performance, statistics, even tx-power settings, all cry for more attention.
- Invest in a unified and easy for the end user, management GUI on top of the great but nerd-oriented webfig/winbox.
- Extend their cloud with more features (like management).
- (Finally) introduce a new kernel into ROS.
<- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ->
I choose Ubiquiti:
- For a unifi(ed) management platform.
- When ease of configuration even by end-users is needed.
- For the beautiful, accessible (cloud-based) (but also browser-heavy) GUI with statistics.
- For much more complete wifi products and better wifi performance.
- For much better configuration of the PtP wireless devices (on the fly tx-power setting, dedicated radio for scanning and configuration, detailed statistics).
What I wish Ubiquiti did differently:
- Put more features into the GUI, while keeping their intuitive approach.
- Have something as light and powerful as winbox is.
- Improve their PtP performance.
- Introduce 60GHz PtP and PtMP products.
- Write better documantation.
Though I'd point out how UBNT fails to grasp concept of uplink interface in routers for router on the stick configs. That's something beyond me.
My problem with lack of uplink in devices is that I use for example two CRS317 switches attached to hypervisors and I need "somewhat 10G" router for inter-VLAN routing with statefull firewall between zones. Firewall is obviously crucial here since if I didn't need that additional security I could just stuff everything into single VLAN and call it a day. Stateless firewalls are pain in the ass to configure securely. There are jumbo frames everywhere so I don't necessarily need hardcore performance. With MikroTik my options start from CCR1009 for like 500$, go through CCR1016, CCR1036 and then there's somewhere CCR1072. With UBNT to get 10G port I have EdgeRouter™ Infinity for two kidneys. THE END. And I'll be using one or two 10G ports on it. 10/10.Though I'd point out how UBNT fails to grasp concept of uplink interface in routers for router on the stick configs. That's something beyond me.
I don't have any experience with Ubiquity, but I did use some other consumer-oriented devices. And I'd say that sticking to some (hard-coded?) concepts such as separate uplink interface (which kind of kills concept of router on a stick) is part of making those devices much more user-friendly than mikrotik.
And I don't agree that QuickSet failed miserably. Perhaps it'd need some more operation mode (such as switch+AP mode, but some modes are not supported by other vendors in the same price range, so why bother?) ... What might be proper way to go is perhaps detect that some setting on device was done outside QuickSet and as result to (permanently) disable QuickSet option for such device. My feeling (based on forum posts) is that quite some users changed a thing or two outside QuckSet, then returned to QuickSet and changed a thing or two there ... and this last step messed the whole config.
Good, TILE is a dead architecture anyway, RB4011 outperforms it on a core for core basis. Users with those devices can continue using old RouterOS version, it should not be a reason to hold development back on everything.Do all people asking for new kernel realize that it would mean dropping support for WHOLE current CCR series since Linux kernel officially dropped support for Tile-Gx CPUs architecture? While I'm not saying Tile-Gx is awesome it'd still mean dropping support for devices that are:
1) still being sold in fact
2) not even few years after EOS.
3) kinda flagship series of routers...
Mikrotik employees many times stated that they are not using built-in kernel module for TILE architecture. Instead, they are using their own module developed in cooperation with manufacturer of those CPU. Dropping TILE support from new kernel is not relevant to RouterOS.
Considering that another Tile CCR has been released like few days ago I guess we're gonna wait xD. Yeah it probably will be ARM but I think MikroTik can't move to ARM on flagships yet considering how broken ARM version of ROS is as of now. RB4011 is basically bugged disaster.So it seems it's CCR versus ROS7 ... I wonder who's loosing?
If this is the case, then Mikrotik urgently needs to introduce new line of high-end routers which will replace current CCR roster, based on some modern platform (I wonder if ARM is that platform). I don't think Mikrotik can survive with top of the line routers new from factory running obsolete ROS version.
Only after that we'll see ROS7.
But all the complains about ARM are wireless related, right? A pure router (a true CCR) could do well, couldn't it? The 4011 has some problems with the FSP+ ports - but they are chipset related, not CPU related.Considering that another Tile CCR has been released like few days ago I guess we're gonna wait xD. Yeah it probably will be ARM but I think MikroTik can't move to ARM on flagships yet considering how broken ARM version of ROS is as of now. RB4011 is basically bugged disaster.So it seems it's CCR versus ROS7 ... I wonder who's loosing?
If this is the case, then Mikrotik urgently needs to introduce new line of high-end routers which will replace current CCR roster, based on some modern platform (I wonder if ARM is that platform). I don't think Mikrotik can survive with top of the line routers new from factory running obsolete ROS version.
Only after that we'll see ROS7.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=138613But all the complains about ARM are wireless related, right? A pure router (a true CCR) could do well, couldn't it? The 4011 has some problems with the FSP+ ports - but they are chipset related, not CPU related.
Or I am missing something?
Well, apart wifi (still a mess), almost all problems on this thread are related to SFP module on SFP+ cage needing auto negotiation disabled. I saw one (two?) people complaining about instability - but they gone away. Maybe a lemon? Many others said it was stable on production, so...viewtopic.php?f=3&t=138613But all the complains about ARM are wireless related, right? A pure router (a true CCR) could do well, couldn't it? The 4011 has some problems with the FSP+ ports - but they are chipset related, not CPU related.
Or I am missing something?
Many minor issues like reboots, freezes, SFP issues plenty of butthurt. I guess ARM devices also don't support CPU clock adjustments. I also personally use hAP ac2 and I didn't manage to get USB modem to work. The same modem plugged to CCR1009 works flawlessly so I ended up connecting 3g backup line to core router instead of edge router which doesn't really make much sense tbh from infrastructure standpoint but it was the only option I had...
Basically ARM support is quite incomplete comparing to other platforms including Tile-Gx.
But all the complains about ARM are wireless related, right? A pure router (a true CCR) could do well, couldn't it? The 4011 has some problems with the FSP+ ports - but they are chipset related, not CPU related. Or I am missing something?
I saw one (two?) people complaining about instability - but they gone away. Maybe a lemon?
I'm using hardware switch a lot in hAP ac², even with 9k jumbo and looping traffic twice through that switch (from cpu port to 2x HA inline L2 IPS, back to hAP, to second router) and didn't experience instabilities. It sounds like coin toss. I'm very satisfied with hAP ac² switch because I use 9k jumbo in whole LAN so it was nice to be able to do all fragmentation on edge router.@mkx: Interesting! similar happened to me when I tried to limit bandwidth to one particular port via switch menu! Whole unit was disconnecting on regular basis.. I guess the switch in RBD52G is not that good after all
Well it didn't work for me. Cause seemed linked with wifi, after investigation with the support they asked me to return the unit. Had also some switch vlan configurations. I have no use for a unit that hang at least once a day. Maybe that was just bad luck but I am not willing to try out all the units of my supplier to tell...I'm using hardware switch a lot in hAP ac², even with 9k jumbo and looping traffic twice through that switch (from cpu port to 2x HA inline L2 IPS, back to hAP, to second router) and didn't experience instabilities. It sounds like coin toss. I'm very satisfied with hAP ac² switch because I use 9k jumbo in whole LAN so it was nice to be able to do all fragmentation on edge router.@mkx: Interesting! similar happened to me when I tried to limit bandwidth to one particular port via switch menu! Whole unit was disconnecting on regular basis.. I guess the switch in RBD52G is not that good after all
That said I didn't limit bandwidth on switch.