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seba1976
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RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Tue May 10, 2016 11:37 pm

Hi,

I've never worked with MikroTik before, so I apologize for any mistakes I'm probably gonna make. Now to the point.

I work for a small company, and they have (for third party recommendations) decided they wanted a MikroTik solution. The same person who made the recommendation, suggested two possible devices for us to choose from: a RB3011UiAS-RM and a RB1100AHx2, "minimum".

We have 2 WAN providers, 3 in the near future, and 6 client PCs that need Internet access. Very small. So the question is, which device should we choose, and what are the differences between the two. Also, I don't know if it makes any difference, but I have zero experience with configuring RouterOS.

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give me.
 
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NathanA
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Wed May 11, 2016 3:21 pm

Tough call. Probably depends on your requirements and your risk tolerance:
  1. 3011 is a very new product, relatively speaking, and is also the first Routerboard of its kind (ARM CPU architecture). There could be bugs and instability this early in the game. 1100/AH has been around a while, and MikroTik has been working with its CPU architecture (PowerPC) a lot longer, and so should be more "baked in".
  2. They are both very similar in that they are both all-gigabit, 1U-rackmount, dual-core machines.
  3. The 1100 has a microSD internally for storage expansion while the 3011 doesn't.
  4. ...but the 3011 also has a USB3 port which can serve as a storage expansion port and more, while the 1100 has no USB support. (Also, USB3 storage likely to be much faster than microSD on the 1100.)
  5. They also both have two 5-port gigabit switch groups, but 1100 has 3 additional standalone gigabit interfaces.
  6. But the 3011 has an SFP port, so if you need at least one fiber connection...
  7. The 3011 also has that spiffy color LCD on the front, too.
  8. The 1100 has hardware IPsec acceleration in the CPU/SoC, which I don't think the 3011 has, so you might get better VPN performance on the 1100.
  9. Interestingly, they seem to be neck-and-neck at general packet forwarding performance, with the 3011 beating out the 1100 in certain scenarios and vice-versa in other scenarios.
  10. The 1100 has upgradeable RAM, but it maxes out at only 1.5GiB and these days the only model that ships already has the RAM maxed out (they used to sell a cheaper 1100 with 1/3rd the RAM pre-installed), so basically the 1100 as-shipped has an extra 50% RAM benefit over the 3011. Probably only useful if you plan to handle huge routing tables (full BGP IPv4 feed, etc.).
  11. The 1100 comes preloaded with a level 6 RouterOS license while the 3011 comes with a level 5. But you probably won't ever run into the limitations that level 5 would enforce on you if we are talking about a small office scenario.
  12. The 3011 is roughly half the cost of the 1100.
Good luck,

-- Nathan
 
seba1976
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Wed May 11, 2016 10:19 pm

Thanks a lot Nathan. I think your point number one is what will have the more weight in our decision, in part because I was feeling the same about the 3011 being "new", and stability is very important in this case. But, easy of use is also crucial, as I have no experience with this, and to be honest, I feel a little bit lost so far. Which takes me to the next question:

Regarding the 3 standalone interfaces of the 1100 vs the two 5-port switched groups of the 3011, would that difference make any of the two easier to configure? What is the practical difference of having those two setups in the hardware?
 
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andressis2k
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Fri May 13, 2016 11:10 pm

In a SOHO envroiment, you'll not apreciate differences between both models.

RB3011 is smaller, passive cooling and lower power consumption.

Direct CPU ports are important with high traffic load (for example If you have 1gbps WAN). RB1100 has 3 RJ45, and RB3011 has 1 SFP port

For a small / medium office, I'll choose RB3011. If you need to run IPSec VPN, them go to RB1100
 
seba1976
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Sat May 14, 2016 12:04 am

Well, 3011 will be then.

How about configuration? It is clear to me that in the 1100 the two WAN are connected to two of the three standalone interfaces. Where would I connect them in the 3011? If I connect them to one of the switched ports, how would I stop the traffic being repeated between LAN and WAN1 and WAN2? Is it all the same? All the tutorials start by saying something like "Let's assume we have three ethernet inputs, let's name them WAN1, WAN2 and LAN..." But I find it hard to grasp the concept of not having any direct indication in the actual devices, about what input represent what exactly.
 
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andressis2k
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Sat May 14, 2016 1:51 am

Dont' worry. Switch is internal, and has no effect in your configuration.

In RB3011 you has 10 ethernet interfaces, isolated between them, and you can configure it as you want

If you want to use both WAN , search "pcc load balancing" on wiki

If you want to use as primary - backup, search "WAN failover"

Regards
 
dancollins
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Sat May 14, 2016 3:03 am

Tough call. Probably depends on your requirements and your risk tolerance:

[*]The 1100 has a microSD internally for storage expansion while the 3011 doesn't.
[*]...but the 3011 also has a USB3 port which can serve as a storage expansion port and more, while the 1100 has no USB support. (Also, USB3 storage likely to be much faster than microSD on the 1100.)

-- Nathan

pity that the usb3 of the RB3011 does not work when connected to a hard drive with usb3 door, and I also tried to write this thing in two different posts on this forum, but no one ever bothered to answer me ... explain me what to do to receive an answer from someone here? I repeat: the USB3 of 'RB3011 NOT work if connected to a hard drive USB3. Regards.

Dan Collins
 
jarda
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Sat May 14, 2016 7:40 am

Maybe the current is not sufficient. Use separate power adaptor to feed the disk.
 
dancollins
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RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Sat May 14, 2016 10:34 am

Tnx for reply. No, my power supply is a 1A nominal. And I tryed with a powered hub too...


Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk
 
JanezFord
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 10:41 am

How much IPSEC traffic can 3011 handle? Has anyone tested it for example with aes128/sha1 or aes256/sha1 ? Can't find any tests on the internet.

JF
 
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NathanA
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 12:12 pm

pity that the usb3 of the RB3011 does not work when connected to a hard drive with usb3 door, and I also tried to write this thing in two different posts on this forum, but no one ever bothered to answer me ... explain me what to do to receive an answer from someone here? I repeat: the USB3 of 'RB3011 NOT work if connected to a hard drive USB3.
Perhaps the first step to getting an answer on the forums is not expressing that you feel like you are entitled to one. This is a *user* forum, where MikroTik *users* exchange information and share experiences with one another; this is not an official support forum. Maybe you haven't gotten an answer because no other *user* here knows the answer to your problem? I don't work for MikroTik, and I have never tested a USB disk drive with an RB3011. I don't even HAVE an RB3011 to test with.

You might see MikroTik employees hanging out here once in a while, but they don't read every post and this is not where they conduct customer support. If you need support, you have to e-mail MikroTik, not post on the forums.

-- Nathan
 
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NathanA
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 12:44 pm

Regarding the 3 standalone interfaces of the 1100 vs the two 5-port switched groups of the 3011, would that difference make any of the two easier to configure?
To clarify and to respond both to this and a later post of yours, the standalone interfaces vs. the switched groups don't constitute a "WAN" vs. "LAN" split. Any port or group of ports can be configured to work however you want.

Any single port that is physically wired to a switch chip in a RouterBoard can be logically broken off from a switch group in order to act as a discrete port, on a port-by-port basis. I imagine that the way that this is handled internally is that the traffic from the discrete ports is tagged somehow (perhaps with a 1Q tag to/from the switch port internally wired to the CPU/SoC), but if you configure a switch port to act as a discrete port, the details of the back-end implementation are hidden away from you, and you can address the port in this configuration as you would any other port. Also, the implementation is good enough that you really lose no features or flexibility when you use a switched port as a discrete port...no broadcast/L2 traffic from one port on the switch will accidentally leak out of another, you can still nest VLANs on such a port (QinQ works great, etc.), each port is assigned its own unique MAC, etc.

There are plusses and minuses to such an implementation, which is why despite the fact that addressing each port individually and treating each one as a separate interface is possible, somebody still might prefer to use a RouterBoard that is not wired up this way (or at least has enough truly discrete interfaces for their purpose(s)).

The "plus" to this arrangement is that if you need several ports to be part of the same L2 broadcast domain, you can have the switch chip forward traffic between those ports at wire speed without bogging down the CPU at all, whereas if you wanted to do the same thing with two truly discrete interfaces and "switch" traffic between them, you would have to make them both members of a bridge, which basically means the CPU/a software process is switching the traffic for you. Having a switch chip in this scenario is more efficient and frees the CPU up to do other things.

The "minus" is that if you are *not* switching between the ports, or if you are but the traffic needs to hit the CPU anyway for further processing or manipulation (MAC filter or MAC nat), then rather than having, say, 5x gigabit interfaces all with a direct path back to the CPU, you instead have 5x ports that all share a single gigabit connection to the CPU, so in essence you have a "port" oversubscription ratio amongst that switch group of 5:1. You will never be able to forward a total of 5Gbit/s of traffic from outside of that switch group to each member port simultaneously; instead, they are sharing 1Gbit/s fabric to the CPU among themselves. (And if they are configured to act as logically discrete ports, and you route traffic from one port in the same physical switch group to another, it will have to leave the switch chip, go to the CPU, and get hairpinned back by the CPU to the same switch chip.)

Also, if there are two switches on a RouterBoard, they cannot forward traffic between each other without going through the CPU, so traffic between each switch chip is limited to 1Gbit/s. You will have to bridge the two master ports of each switch group together if you want all of the ports on the RB to act together as one big switch.

You can see what I am talking about if you consult the block diagrams for the RouterBoard models in question (available at the routerboard.com site).

You should be aware that RouterBoards have two "default" configurations: one that comes preloaded on a router from the factory that sets things up in a relatively sane way (e.g., automatically configures one port as WAN with a DHCP client, and the remaining ports as LAN with a DHCP server, with NAT/masquerade configured by default), and one where there is absolutely no configuration on it whatsoever (no IP addresses, no firewall or NAT rules, no nothing). The stock factory configuration normally sets each member of a switch chip (except one that it might carve out for the WAN interface) to directly switch traffic between each other. But if you wipe out the stock config, by default all switched ports will act as logically discrete interfaces. So you have to pay close attention to whatever base configuration you start with when you go to set it up to work how you want it to work.

-- Nathan
 
dancollins
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 12:55 pm

pity that the usb3 of the RB3011 does not work when connected to a hard drive with usb3 door, and I also tried to write this thing in two different posts on this forum, but no one ever bothered to answer me ... explain me what to do to receive an answer from someone here? I repeat: the USB3 of 'RB3011 NOT work if connected to a hard drive USB3.
Perhaps the first step to getting an answer on the forums is not expressing that you feel like you are entitled to one. This is a *user* forum, where MikroTik *users* exchange information and share experiences with one another; this is not an official support forum. Maybe you haven't gotten an answer because no other *user* here knows the answer to your problem? I don't work for MikroTik, and I have never tested a USB disk drive with an RB3011. I don't even HAVE an RB3011 to test with.

You might see MikroTik employees hanging out here once in a while, but they don't read every post and this is not where they conduct customer support. If you need support, you have to e-mail MikroTik, not post on the forums.

-- Nathan



it seems to me that this is not an independent forum, but certainly a forum for user experiences in any case the mikrotik patronage, since it is a third-level domain from the same manufacturer. I was expecting, as in any case of this kind (eg QNAP) that technicians albeit informally would read and would respond maybe, sometimes. Probably my mistake, thinking that here you could get the technical answers from someone more experienced than me, and not necessarily only by people like me, but people who work on projects mikrotik and knows me, if they exist, of the most in-depth advice that does not are the usual "try changing power supply". For that kind of advice, it should be enough your own common sense. Plus I bought my 3011 three months ago and saw that the natural free support has expired for making contact with the official support Mikrotik from what I understand means paying a ticket. Now, it seems right that for a function not active of which I realized only now I have to pay to receive an answer? For a defect of one of their products? it does not seem quite right.

On the QNAP Forum for example, also open to the public like this, I was able to solve problems on new machines and old with the support of users and technicians of the parent company in an efficient manner and absolutely free. and I assure you that this also happens with other companies to which I bought their products.

Anyway thanks for your clarification, yours truly
Dan
 
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NathanA
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 3:06 pm

Plus I bought my 3011 three months ago and saw that the natural free support has expired for making contact with the official support Mikrotik from what I understand means paying a ticket. Now, it seems right that for a function not active of which I realized only now I have to pay to receive an answer? For a defect of one of their products? it does not seem quite right.
MikroTik does not charge for support. MikroTik doesn't even have a mechanism for charging for support if they wanted to. Some of us have been bugging MikroTik to set up a way of doing premium or priority support for a fee, but they have been very resistant to that idea. They would rather certify consultants and have them handle that load.

I'm not sure where you read that your support for your 3 month old product has already expired, but if you are having problems with it, I bet you will get a response back if you e-mail support@mikrotik.com.

-- Nathan
 
dancollins
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 4:13 pm

I'm not sure where you read that your support for your 3 month old product has already expired, but if you are having problems with it, I bet you will get a response back if you e-mail support@mikrotik.com.

-- Nathan
Hello, I am referring to what is read here: http://www.mikrotik.com/support.html

however, I will try to contact the email address you provided. Thanks for the clarification.

Best regards,
Dan
 
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normis
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 4:17 pm

We actually reply to people who use RB112 or other devices made 12-13 years ago :)
No answer to your question? How to write posts
 
dancollins
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon May 16, 2016 7:20 pm

We actually reply to people who use RB112 or other devices made 12-13 years ago :)
Hi Normis,
I use your RB3011 bought three months ago with a problem of recognition of any HD usb3 I try to connect to his door ...
 
jarda
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Mon May 16, 2016 8:09 pm

Make supout and send to support. Maybe they will be able to help.
 
seba1976
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Re: RB1100AHx2 or RB3011UiAS-RM

Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:00 pm

Thanks a lot Nathan, it's much more clear to me now. Sorry for the disappearing act :D but the client haven't bought the RB yet (though they will) and I got super busy with some other problems. You can be sure I will be asking a lot of questions once I had the device. I'm really concerned about the default configuration now :lol: .

Best regards.

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