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eben
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Plastic ethernet connectors

Wed Jan 18, 2012 9:34 am

So...

Yesterday I received my first consignment of routerboards with plastic RJ45 connectors.

Today, I'm supposed to mount one of those routerboards near the top of this mast.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to work out how high this mast is, just look at the 60cm UBNT dish that's fitted with a radome.

This is typical of many of the masts that are used all over the world, 250mm wide, 30 - 40m high and held steady with stay wires.

These masts move. Not much, but they move in the wind. Especially in a place like Cape Town where there is a "Souteaster" blowing at an average of 50km/h for half the year and then a "Northwester" blowing at an average of 50km/h for the other half of the year.

How do we ensure that RJ45 connectors don't come undone from the constant shaking up there? We solder them to the metal chassis on the connector. One blob of solder is all that it takes to secure a connector to a routerboard and to ensure that you don't have to climb up that mast at 2:00am in a raging storm to go and seat a connector that's shaken loose.

Then MikroTik came up with this absolutely stupid beyond belief plan of using plastic connectors.

What do I (and all other with the same problem that I have) do now?

Do we look at competing products?

Do we not use the new, fast routers?

Do we use chemicals to secure the connectors?
I really don't think it's a good idea to use chemicals / adhesives. At least with solder, you can unsolder. There's no way to "unresin" a connector once it's in.

I'm really fed up and would appreciate any advice.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Wed Jan 18, 2012 11:55 am

I agree this is a stupid change..


Maybe a dab of hot glue is the quick fix ?
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Wed Jan 18, 2012 8:25 pm

Just my 2 cents, but I would never put a SOHO MT router in a tower. The plastic ethernet you only find in the cheapest ones.
Why don't you just go for RB450G ?
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Wed Jan 18, 2012 8:31 pm

Just my 2 cents, but I would never put a SOHO MT router in a tower. The plastic ethernet you only find in the cheapest ones.
Is the 433GL a SOHO MT router?
Why don't you just go for RB450G ?
Because you can't plug radio cards into it.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 7:29 am

Yeap; i feel the words EPIC and FAIL belong in the same sentence as PLASTIC and RJ45 CONNECTOR.

Seriously though, it is a pretty painful change; perhaps MT could comment if there are likely to be higher cost options with the metal connectors? For those of us who have to access equipment up masts; the few extra $ arent likely to cause too many sleepless nights.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 7:58 am

MikroTik's silence is deafening.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:03 am

We still offer both kinds of products. You have the choice that you are asking for. We have RB433 with metallic connectors, and RB433L with plastic ones. We have RB411AR and we have RB711-2Hn. One is with metal connectors and higher price, other is plastic connectors and lower price.

Isn't this what you are asking for?
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:04 am

Hey Normis,

Is there an Rb433AH replacement (or will 433Ah continue to be available?) with metal connectors?

Thanks!
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 9:10 am

RB433AH is still available and we have no immediate plans to discontinue it. RB4xxL series is an addition, not a replacement.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:15 am

Ah! Then i think maybe we have all misunderstood :) RB433AH is my favorite! :D
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:17 am

So where is the 433 with 680MHz processor, gigabit ethernet and metal connectors?
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:22 am

So where is the 433 with 680MHz processor, gigabit ethernet and metal connectors?
http://routerboard.com/RB435G (at 189$ it's only 40$ more expensive than the RB433AH with 100mbit ports and two less miniPCI slots. I think Gigabit justifies 40$ price increase, plus you get bonus miniPCI slots. USB ports and SD slot for free)

http://routerboard.com/RB493G
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:24 am

eeehehehe smackdown. Normis wins that round.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:43 am

eeehehehe smackdown. Normis wins that round.
Not quite. I have a couple of 435Gs in the field. They work well, but they're great if you put 3 x R52Hn or 3 x SR71 in them.

The RB493G - as you know Normis, I've been trying to register my new ones that arrived a couple of days ago - is a very messy router to use in enclosed spaces. The one ethernet port at the bottom is cool, but the ones on the side have caused us a fair amount of problems when using shielded cable. They are good at ground level, but really not fit for purpose 20m up in the air.

I dread the day when MT drops our current staple - the RB411AH.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:46 am


Not quite. I have a couple of 435Gs in the field. They work well, but they're great if you put 3 x R52Hn or 3 x SR71 in them.
if they are great, what's the problem?
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:14 am


Not quite. I have a couple of 435Gs in the field. They work well, but they're great if you put 3 x R52Hn or 3 x SR71 in them.
if they are great, what's the problem?
Spelling error - NOT great.

CPU use goes very high when there are three radios in the 435G and they are all pumping data.

We have found that putting more than two backbone or customer facing radios into a RB435G makes for unpleasant experiences for everyone.

I don't know what it's like in the rest of the world, but our clients have big internet connections. The businesses start at 5Mb. If we have 20 customers each connecting to one sector and downloading data accordingly and there are three sectors connected to a 435G, things don't work.

What we - and I believe many other WISPs - need is something that can handle two big cards, like the SR71 or the R52Hn when they are connected to UBNT dishes or UBNT sectors with clients on the other end that use their data.

The 433AH works fine, but the 100Mb network card is the bottleneck.

All we want is a 433AH with gigabit shielded ports.

Two cards in a 435G works fine. The GB NIC can handle the traffic, but ...

Using a 435G and having three empty miniPCI slots - like what I have had to do of late - is really not the best way to invest your money in a Third World country. If I was in the USA or Europe where I could bill in real money, it would be different, but here we bill in local currency, but have to pay for everything with real money. The price different between a 433AH and a 435G is enough to buy a nice Canon digital camera. Now multiply by 72 - which is the number of towers I have to refresh this year.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:15 am

This is highly unlikely. If you have unaccounted CPU usage, email support. This is unrelated to topic anymore.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:18 am

This is highly unlikely. If you have unaccounted CPU usage, email support. This is unrelated to topic anymore.
I've told you before, it's time for MUM Cape Town so we can show you guys how your equipment works in the field.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:20 am

The price different between a 433AH and a 435G (..) nice Canon digital camera.
40$?
CPU use goes very high when there are three radios in the 435G and they are all pumping data.
the devices are nearly identical, except the type of ports. you are probably facing a software issue. like I said, email support with the details.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:32 am

the devices are nearly identical, except the type of ports. you are probably facing a software issue. like I said, email support with the details.
I will, but having looked long and hard at the various amounts of information that's available, I believe it's the same story as when one inserts a RB604 into an RB600 or an RB800. The "daughterboard" reduces performance. In this case, the "daughterboard" is the two extra miniPCI slots on the back of the RB435G.

The time for misdirection, smoke and mirrors is over.

Getting back to the original question and a recent comment about using a glue gun... Seeing at I have no idea how to get a working electric powered glue gun 34 meters in the sky with the glue still being hot, how do we secure the shielded connectors to these plastic connectors in such a way that they don't fall out when the tower moves?
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:35 am

You are the offtopic king, aren't you :) What in the world could be relation with RB604 to RB435G ???
misdirection, smoke and mirrors
yes, please stop with misdirection, smoke and mirrors and email support with this issue. You are confusing other people with these weird claims.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:42 am

You are the offtopic king, aren't you :) What in the world could be relation with RB604 to RB435G ???
misdirection, smoke and mirrors
yes, please stop with misdirection, smoke and mirrors and email support with this issue. You are confusing other people with these weird claims.
The RJ45 connector coming loose after six months of shaking is not a weird claim. It's a reality.

IRQ conflicts are not weird claims. They are a reality.

Come here and face your customers.

You can face them in places like Las Vegas, Brazil, China and Europe where they kow tow to you, but you are not prepared to face us guys who were using your stuff when the Americans were still madly in love with Canopy and you couldn't get a foot in the door edgeways.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:45 am

I wasn't talking about connectors, I was talking about RB435G. About connectors - we will investigate why this could happen. MikroTik did come to South Africa in 2007 and we will come again, possibly this or next year.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:49 am

MikroTik did come to South Africa in 2007 and we will come again, possibly this or next year.
I remember that... Who was it who was in the country and who was it who joined us via satellite?

We are looking forward to having your people here.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:52 am

joined us via satellite
no idea what you mean by that.
Who was it who was in the country
Two people from support, two from sales, I think. Not me.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:57 am

Today I saw broken off a plastic Ethernet port. FTP cable has greater power than Ethernet !

Wrapping the cable is NOT good, the same problem as in the SXT
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:31 pm

Today I saw broken off a plastic Ethernet port. FTP cable has greater power than Ethernet !

Wrapping the cable is NOT good, the same problem as in the SXT
oh my God, this shouldn't happen to me! gotta do something to prevent this.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:51 pm

don't use force, be careful.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:49 pm

don't use force, be careful.
Kinda hard to do that when using a shielded Cat-5e cable, which i'm using, but not to the SXT at the moment. i already using it to omnitik, and it's fine since omnitik case pretty much support that. looking this, i don't think i'm gonna use the shielded cat-5e cable to the SXT, because i'm going to install it on a client tomorrow. my first SXT and OMNITIK :lol:
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:50 pm

Not sure how Honzam did this, but this is the first time I see something like that, nd we have sold a lot of SEXTANT devices.
so, winet, this is not a very common problem.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:21 pm

 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:27 pm

i see. but shielded cat-5e cable isn't too much important to be used on CPE. so i'm still gonna use UTP anyway. i only use STP when needed.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:37 pm

yes, because in that link, there is no SEXTANT. if you yank the cable, you can break it off, but not in the SEXTANT, where it's tightly mounted, and cable is secured with the door.
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 4:42 pm

Have you ever installed or SXT Sextant? How to have the door to keep the cable? You are funny man but me.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:08 pm

Not sure how Honzam did this, but this is the first time I see something like that, nd we have sold a lot of SEXTANT devices.
so, winet, this is not a very common problem.
When you use FTP cable and close door Sextant so the pressure is on the Plastic Ethernet connector so large that it risk of break off! This is our first sextant mounted outside with FTP, and after opening the door to break the plug itself!

Absolutely no brute force was used. We will not complain, fix it yourself :(

Mikrotik itself accepted that the SXT have problem (angle connector) and the new revision will have angled connector. Why sextant has the same problem? :(
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:49 pm

i think, but not tested it myself yet, that we should bend the S/FTP cable slowly to the right angle before plugging it. good to know this, so it won't happen to anyone else. my STP cable is pretty hard, but once it bent, it won't straight itself until i straighten it, i think the outer layer is made of PVC, the same material for water pipe.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:31 pm

Hi,

same problem here, today costumers called my, no service available, so i have to clim up to the pole, and what i see sextant with
demolished ethernet connector.
I resolder it quickly (no time for exchange hole unit), i buyed about 20 units, will this happen on all units?
To resolve problem i will use hot-glue, with losing warranty!
I think ethernet connector on sextant is scrap!
Why not the same connector like SXT?
save money on the connector is failure, i don't buy any unit until this is fixed!

mistry7
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:32 pm

hot glue will not lose warranty, if you use it to secure sextant ethernet connector
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:38 pm

This means: "finish at home"
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Fri Mar 09, 2012 8:44 am

Just FYI - but most of these connectors has large plastic and/or metalic legs going through the PC Boards. I'd suggest that the metal legs be soldered to the PC board, or if plastic legs, that the back of the legs sticking out of the PC Board be melted. This will ensure that the connector cannot lift, or twist from the PC board as indicated in the pictures posted...
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:41 pm

Hi,

same problem here, today costumers called my, no service available, so i have to clim up to the pole, and what i see sextant with
demolished ethernet connector.
I resolder it quickly (no time for exchange hole unit), i buyed about 20 units, will this happen on all units?
To resolve problem i will use hot-glue, with losing warranty!
I think ethernet connector on sextant is scrap!
Why not the same connector like SXT?
save money on the connector is failure, i don't buy any unit until this is fixed!

mistry7

yukkk!!! a LOW cost RJ45....that's the problem..when sales people controls the engineer. :)
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:54 pm

yukkk!!! a LOW cost RJ45....that's the problem..when sales people controls the engineer. :)
It's not the sales people.

It's the cost accountants!
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:46 pm

I think that MT didn't now what the WISP wanted. We looks for good Products and in the second time on the price. When the Board is 3$ more expensive it is NOT the problem for WISP.
But when we have a downtime on a Board, then irritation buy the customer is bigger then 3$.

The Client's comparatively between price and performance. The Backbone AP's must work 100% stable and hear is 3$ or 5$ more NOT the problem. 1 hour servicetime cost >30$ !!


dingsingo
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:58 am

@dingsingo

I Agree 100% !!
I dont buy New Hardware to have issue with the new Parts!
Sextant is dead for me until this is fixed!
Back to Antennas for compartment, not so Easy as Sextant,
But 100% for Long Time! Back to RB4xx

Mistry7
 
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Plastic ethernet connectors

Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:53 am

Well I might too add a thing or two to this topic.
Indeed these new plastic sockets are inferior to metal covered ones, which never had any kind of trouble. I had to resolder few of them already when my people brought them back and said they didn't even use excessive force. And you know what..I believe them. It's quite hard to unplug the cable even standing on the ground and having sextant on the table, so imagine doing that with straight reaching hand on top of the mast while wind blowing all over.. The fixing lever facing downside isn't a good idea at all. I advise to revise the design and give up those waterpipe plastic sockets.. I'm willing to pay few $ more for proper connectors than spending my afternoons resoldering and gluing broken connectors. I don't even talk about warranty..
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:24 am

Dont let customers touch your equipment, simple. :)

I'll side with normis on this one.. the plastic connectors offer lower cost, plain and simple.

If you need something more robust for your application, pay for it.

Heres another suggestion:

http://www.networktechinc.com/cgi-bin/k ... shldm.html

also, if you are worried about connectors coming out of a socket on a tower, you must be using the wrong ethernet cabling solution. Everything you put on a tower should have sufficient strain relief

to never come apart. this may include metal ties to the tower leg, and a drip & Strain relief loop if you're worried about that.

just some things to think about.

Also on the sextant / SXT issue...

If you can't undo the cable without breaking it, you should not be touching radio equipment.
 
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Re: Plastic ethernet connectors

Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:52 pm

when terminating your shielded cable or tough cable, don't run the sheathing all the way up to the connector. Leave 1" of exposed wire. The connector wont be so hard to plug in, and wont put the ethernet plug at risk. The door will hold the sheathing in place. Use 2 zip ties to hold the wire in place on the SXT/Sextant/nanobridge/etc/etc mounting pole.

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