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wpmosc
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3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:44 pm

Hi all,

I am running the following Setup in bridge Mode
all with a perfect Line of sight on N Mode with NV2

Office Internet SXT 5HnD < 1.1km> SXT SA5 ac < 0.8km> SXT 5HnD

the one in the middle is on a high Sight and there are hundreds of Transmitters there, was running it at std with Ch width of 40Mhz and got Connections of 120mbps with a bad CCQ and got a bandwidth of 3.5 - 5mbps.
Then all of a sudden my band width dropped to almost nothing. Moved the middle SXT away 20-30m from all other Wireless TX equipment there (was 1.5m next to a 1kw FM Transmitter there) and got a perfect Line of sight. Restricted my Channel width to 10Mhz and moved Frequency to off of Center Frequency. Restricted my MCS 0-5 and 8-10 and Card Rates ( except the middle Router at default TX) Got a better CCQ, but my Bandwidth is only about 300kpbs.

Have the following now from the middle Router to the Office TX/RX Rates 6 - 19.5mbps/ 19.5-24mbps, Signal Tx/Rx -54/-64 Signal to Noise 45db and a Tx/Rx CCQ 20-32/ 25-52%.
From the Middle to the other side I have Tx/Rx Rates 13-27mbps/ 19.5-27mbps, Signal Tx/Rx -50/-61 dbm Signal to Noise 46db and a Tx/Rx CCQ 50-71/31-45%.
From the Office to the middle Route same signal Strength, signal to Noise 66db and TX/Rx CCQ 30-50/33-43%
from the other side to the middle to the other Side same Signal Strenghth, signal to Noise 70db and Tx/Rx CCQ 40-50/ 70-89%

Could my center Router be damaged ? Who can help, I will be happy with a 10-15mpbs Bandwidth.

Regards
Wilfried
 
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:50 pm

Is there any traffic right now on the devices?
 
wpmosc
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:35 pm

Yes, very little.
 
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Sun Apr 05, 2020 3:41 pm

A bad CCQ will make your interface drop in MCS to a lower value. Value can usually be seen in "registration" tab of the SXT SA5 ac. (Or interface status at the SXT 5)
NV2 is not detectable by 802.11n/ac . So you are in signal competition with those others, and generate adjacent channel interference to each other.
Adjacent channel interference is worse than co-channel interference. And I don't understand what you mean by "moved Frequency to off of Center Frequency" but it means there is probably no co-channel interference but adjacent channel interference. (co-channel means here "listen to each other", check packet size for timing, include processing rts/cts handshakes, and wait)
I suppose your SXT 5's are fairly standalone. So the SXT SA5 ac is probably the one receiving interference.

Do your neighborgs make use of the weather radar DFS channels? (5600-5660) (Not many like those because they check for 10 minutes before starting, so they might be free).
What does "freq usage" learn you?
 
wpmosc
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:11 pm

Thanks for the advice, definitely my 5AC Sector that is battling.

Checked Frequency Usage again and moved to another Frequency. Definitely there was adjacent Channel Interference, the one signal is about the same and the other is worse, CCQ overall improved but still not great on the problem Link. so re-enabled my higher MCS's again and now getting a bandwidth of about 3.mbps on my weaker Link, definitely an Improvement, but could still be a lot better.

Any advantages of using Auto Frequency ?
Would i get a better results if I upgrade my SXT 5 HnD's to SXT Sq 5 Ac's and move all from n to ac ?

Regards
W
 
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Tue Apr 07, 2020 2:03 pm

Do not rely on "auto" frequency selection, pick it manually ! Almost always the better choice ! (If you use DFS channels, make your channel list with the ones you want to use, if DFS forces you to move)

Replacing NV2 with 802.11ac is another experiment. AC could go in co-channel mode with the rest, even N can do that.

Some background reading on 2.4 / 5 GHz , recommended! http://divdyn.com/docs/2.4-GHz-is-Dead-v1.00.pdf)

My personal setup (holiday resort) ended with 802.11ac as stable enough and good performance. The AP's can change to nstreme or nv2 and the CPE stations will follow this.
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wpmosc
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:14 pm

Thanks for the helpful reply.

On the 2.4Ghz Article, I concur and thats why I moved my Link from 2.4Ghz to 5Ghz after 15 years on WRT54G Routers with Yagis.

I did a lot of of reading (this really helped - https://shop.duxtel.com.au/article_info ... cles_id=51) and fine tuning to my setup and have
a fairly stable Connection now, although I only get a Bandwidth of about 4-5 mbps across my Link. I did move around the best DFS Spectrum,
which actually is allowed unlicensed Spectrum in my Country. Cut my MCS Rates to the minimum, adjusted TX Power down, moved my Routers again to the
best possible Position and am stuck on 10Mhz Channel Width with fairly decent Signal and CCQ, the Moment I move to 20Mhz my Link breaks under Load. Although
when use the same Spectrum on 10Mhz in adjacent Channels it is stable. Sadly Frequency Usage or Wireless Snooper does seem to function in that Frequency Range,
but Spectral Scan and History helped, although the Chipset on the SXT SA does not support this and I dragged a Omnitik to my high Site for this. By now I am convinced
that my Receiver in the SXT SA has some damage and is not working properly, will do some more Tests with other Mikrotik Routers I have, to confirm his. On my one Link
there is a huge difference (15db) across multiple Frequencies between the signal in both Chains. Last but not least moving to AC only makes real sense when you utilise
80mhz or 160Mhz Channel width, as there will no gain on 20 and 40Mhz Channel widths.

One last Question I have, where did you get the RouterOS Info Window in Winbox ?

Regards
W
 
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Wed Apr 22, 2020 1:08 am


One last Question I have, where did you get the RouterOS Info Window in Winbox ?

I expected that question, because it is non-trivial
It comes from the optional DUDE package. But it is not in the Dude client screen, it is in the RouterOS Winbox menu, in Dude, RouterOS Info
Klembord-2.jpg
DUDE with its SNMP and RouerOS probes and SYSLOG data collector has proven to be extremely usefull in following up this Mikrotik (and Engenius and Draytek) network over more than a year now. Lots off traffic graphs and full incident reporting (link down and up) for links and AP's.
This one screen (Router Info) learns me a lot over the instant state of the wifi PtP and PtMP connections.
DUDE runs on a dedicated hEX (which is also my remote management entry point)
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Wed Apr 22, 2020 1:36 am

Sadly Frequency Usage or Wireless Snooper does seem to function in that Frequency Range,

I had no problem with that, as long as the scanned interface is not the one you are connected to. (It drops the current connections to do the scanning)
 
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Re: 3 Router Wireless Link via Highsight- CCQ and Bandwidth problem

Wed Apr 22, 2020 1:50 am

Last but not least moving to AC only makes real sense when you utilise
80mhz or 160Mhz Channel width, as there will no gain on 20 and 40Mhz Channel widths.


By the way: I fully agree with the Duxtel article, unfortunately the neighborgs don't.

Maybe there is some value in AC.... https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkell ... ifference/ , not sure how well it is implemented in Mikrotik or if it still applies to SXT directional antennas.

"The second key factor is ‘Beamforming’. Typically wireless signal is simply thrown out from your router equally in all directions, like ripples when throwing a stone into a pond. This is why you should place your router as close to the centre of your home or office and as high up as possible.

Beamforming is different. It is built into the 802.11ac specification and is ‘smart signal’ which detects where connected devices are and increases signal strength specifically in their direction. Yes it is still a good idea to position your router centrally, but it helps make it less vital.

All this means the performance of 802.11ac is maintained far better at long range than 802.11n. Peak performance may be tripled, but at range 5-10x the speed benefits are not unusual and this is where 802.11ac comes into its own. Some numbers for example:

802.11ac at one metre: 90MBps, 10 metres: 70MBps and at 20 metres behind two solid walls: 50MBps
802.11n at one metre: 30MBps, 10 metres: 20MBps and at 20 metres behind two solid walls: 5-10MBps"

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