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edmidor
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Best hardware options for office AP

Fri Apr 16, 2010 6:53 pm

What is the current most recommended combination of routerboard and N wireless card(s) for office N access point?

No wireless links this time, rather a bunch of laptops with n cards; need as much throughput as possible, as we tend to copy large (GB) files quite often.
 
dipson
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sat Apr 17, 2010 4:38 am

i doubt if mikrotik has sort this n issue out yet, still having some hiccups from d last i read in this forum. send mail to support@mikrotik.com and let us have the response on the forum. wish you all the best.
Best Regards,
Oladipupo Salako
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Lagos, Nigeria.
 
rodolfo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sat Apr 17, 2010 2:31 pm

if you want 1 radio: rb411AH + r52n
If you want two radio: rb433+ 2x r52n
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edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sun Apr 18, 2010 6:07 am

It's office AP, does it need 2 radios?

Also, what are the issues with N in AP context?
 
rodolfo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:39 am

Two radio output mere power and use two different channels. It is better for outdoor applications.
For an office one radio si sufficent.
Using R52n (if you have problems with n) you could change band: 2.4Ghz b, 2.4Ghz g, 2.4Ghz b/g, 2.4Ghz b/g/n, 2.4Ghz n
I dont know issues using rb411h + r52 b/g/n as an access point.
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congo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:58 pm

We are using RB411AH with R52N in an office environment. It is very unstable. I have written several times to these forums about this, and have been experimenting since buying this bundle with no success.
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon Apr 19, 2010 9:12 pm

Hmm... So what do you guys use if MT doesn't work well?
I hardly believe everybody switched to DLink now...
 
rodolfo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Tue Apr 20, 2010 8:46 am

I have no troubles with N.
Hardware capability and routerOS are light years ahead any Dlink device.
But assembly a radio could be not always so simple (you mus choose a good antenna).
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Tue Apr 20, 2010 5:35 pm

I have no troubles with N.
Hardware capability and routerOS are light years ahead any Dlink device.
But assembly a radio could be not always so simple (you mus choose a good antenna).

What is a good N wifi antenna setup?
 
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congo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:09 am

I would also like to know that, regarding an office setup. We are using two MikroTik AC/SWI rubber ducky antennas with the RB411 indoor case.
 
wildbill442
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:13 am

For an office the antenna really isn't going to matter much any rubber duck antenna will work.. Just make sure its for the correct frequency.

L-Com, streakwave, practically any wireless distributor should carry either a dual band or single band rubber duck. (2.4GHz or 5.8GHz)

A single radio is fine, R52n supports MIMO so if you want to take advantage of MIMO get two antennas. You can use two radios if you want to have 2.4 and 5.8GHz in the office. Just depends on what you're trying to support.

Any of the RBs will work, if you're pushing GByte sized files then you may be better off using the H model boards they have faster CPU's.

Anyway that's my 2 cents...

@Congo -- I've got the same setup only in an outdoor environment (dual pol ARC 5GHz antennas) 8mile point to point link and its pushing well over 75mbps UDP.. That's testing to the board, if I were testing through it I'm sure throughput would be higher.
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edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed Apr 21, 2010 5:52 am

Any of the RBs will work, if you're pushing GByte sized files then you may be better off using the H model boards they have faster CPU's.
Oh, that's confusing... So do we have N problems on routerboards, or any of RB will work?
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:06 pm

I don't see the confusion.. I was referring to your original post that said you need to be able to transfer gigabyte sized files... Well the more traffic you push through the board, the higher the load on the CPU, might be best to have the power there if need... The RB***H have a higher clock speed than the standard RB*** so I was suggesting the H models to provide for your bandwidth needs, better to have more power than not enough in my opinion.

I've only used the R52n cards in the RB411AH, but there's no reason to assume they wouldn't work as expected in any other routerboard model. Again I was simply stating the "H" model routerboards (talking routerboards not minipci radios) have a higher clock speed and are suited for more demanding applications.
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edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed Apr 21, 2010 6:19 pm

I was referring to the ongoing controversy in replies: unstable, slow, problematic vs. "no problems at all".
Is there any common patters of usage or config between those who said MT is unusable as office access point due to instability and other issues?
 
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congo
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Tue Apr 27, 2010 9:41 pm

Did anyone say anything about actually using a Routerboard with R52n indoors? Because some people have outdoor point-to-point .11n links running fine (from all the comments it seems they are the minority :) ), and they say it should be okay indoors too. Has anybody tested this with for example notebook clients? Because I have, and the results are poor. I am not debating about the power, but rather the wireless side. I tend to think R52n is the problem (or the wireless driver maybe).

I am not an ISP, and currently only use RBs indoors for wifi and for wired routing. It seems more and more people consider using them for non-ISP applications. We also give lots of them to clients who don't have the bucks for an enterprise grade product.
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sat May 01, 2010 1:30 am

I use 802.11n all day, every day..
I use an atom based AP. (Blackbird) (shameless plug)
I run high output SR71-E cards..

I have a client that is deploying these at over 100 FBOs in the US..
"Runs great, lasts long time"..

If you are TOO close to an 802.11 with it turned all the way up, your client can get swamped and it wont talk...
back off a bit or try turning it down a bit..
Things that make you go "Hmmmmmmmm"...

Craig
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sat May 01, 2010 3:35 am

I use 802.11n all day, every day..
I use an atom based AP. (Blackbird) (shameless plug)
I run high output SR71-E cards..
What? Blackbird SR71? It makes one cool access point, isn't it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SR-71_Blackbird
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Sun May 02, 2010 9:46 am

Play on ID numbers...
http://www.flexrouters.com
Things that make you go "Hmmmmmmmm"...

Craig
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon May 03, 2010 7:29 am

Is there any trick to make it running stable, or SR71 just do better job then R52 for "local" N connectivity?
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon May 03, 2010 11:09 am

Is there any trick to make it running stable, or SR71 just do better job then R52 for "local" N connectivity?
he is just trying to sell it :)

generally, all RouterOS devices perform with similar stability, just the power and price changes. for a small number of users you would be good with RB411 and R52N
No answer to your question? How to write posts
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon May 03, 2010 5:22 pm

I hve no "special tricks" for the SR71.. in the "n" opperation.
It is simply the RouterOS that "Drives" it..

Your biggest factors will be configuration, RF environment, antennas, and the card.. Oh and cables.
You need to have ample CPU... based on users / rules/ services / ISP speeds Etc..

My hardware platform was chosen for a large number of reasons..
Thies devices are installed in remote locations ALL accross the country.. and I do mean ALL..
100 Plus locations in almost all 50 states..
The client wanted the 3G / 4G card housed internal to the Router / AP. (to prevent the 3G modules from growing leggs)
They wantd a LARGE Proxy with ALL traffic passing thru a rule set.
They needed VOIP traffic in both a wired.
They also do not know how many users at any geven time will be online, so they over CPU'd the unit a bit..
Also some of thiese provide fail over for the corporate net should their main link go down..

There are several others as well..

The platform grew from a platform filling a need..

Enough plugging....

We use 400 series Routerboard as APs (in bridging mode) when we need cover a dead spot or to "light up" a seporate area of the installation.. (MUCH less expensive)

look at your environment and user situation and scale accordingly..
That is the great thing about RouterOS... It will scale to what ever you need ..
Things that make you go "Hmmmmmmmm"...

Craig
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon May 03, 2010 6:37 pm

Sigh... This is yet another example of one user saying "it works just fine"; Normis saying "it should work"; and another user saying:
Has anybody tested this with for example notebook clients? Because I have, and the results are poor. I am not debating about the power, but rather the wireless side. I tend to think R52n is the problem (or the wireless driver maybe).
The truth is usually in the middle, but there's no middle here... it either works well, or it doesn't.



Atom is interesting choice... Usually concurrency is heavily involved in systems that have to process high-throughput datastream, but Atom doesn't support out-of-order execution, which should severely limit performance of the entire thing...
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Mon May 03, 2010 11:05 pm

The only "N" issie I have seen is that with 5db ant and card turned up, the client cant be too close to the AP and the client seems to get swamped.... the client can see the AP but can't connect...

I usualy maintain a 2 foot rule... any closer and it gets wierd....

I get very good range, but I cant speak to all RF environments...

My XBox connects at 270Mb if I remember the numbers I was seeing... (RF rates) with the xbox "n" atapter..

STD B/G cards work fine in laptops (at 2 feet pluss)....
Things that make you go "Hmmmmmmmm"...

Craig
 
wildbill442
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Tue May 04, 2010 3:58 am

I have another R52Hn card deployed in a PTMP environment... Anyway it has a mix batch of 30+ clients connecting with no problems....

...Damn that's another outdoor senario...

However I would play with the power settings -- or set to regulatory domain if needed. Prior to the power changes, I did notice clients connecting with single digit signals! I had to play with the power output on both the AP and clients to get them to a reasonable level.

If it works outdoor, it'll work indoor... It's just a level of scale.
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Tue May 04, 2010 10:37 am

The only "N" issie I have seen is that with 5db ant and card turned up, the client cant be too close to the AP and the client seems to get swamped.... the client can see the AP but can't connect...

I usualy maintain a 2 foot rule... any closer and it gets wierd....

I get very good range, but I cant speak to all RF environments...

My XBox connects at 270Mb if I remember the numbers I was seeing... (RF rates) with the xbox "n" atapter..

STD B/G cards work fine in laptops (at 2 feet pluss)....
AFAIK the AC/SWI antennas that we use are 2.2dBi, and the card is at default values. The notebooks are no less than 3 meters (~10 feet) from the AP. Anyway, the SFQ fix seems to solve some of our issues. (Or maybe it is just placebo effect.) I will do some more testing and report back.
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Wed May 05, 2010 6:17 pm

What about overheating issues on R52 cards?
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Fri May 07, 2010 6:42 am

if you want 1 radio: rb411AH + r52n
If you want two radio: rb433+ 2x r52n
They both have 10/100 port. I do realize that on long links it's totally adequate, but for in-house wifi I hoped to actually use N speeds. Is rb800 the only option that has miniPCI and can go beyond 100mbps?
 
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Fri May 07, 2010 12:05 pm

if you want 1 radio: rb411AH + r52n
If you want two radio: rb433+ 2x r52n
They both have 10/100 port. I do realize that on long links it's totally adequate, but for in-house wifi I hoped to actually use N speeds. Is rb800 the only option that has miniPCI and can go beyond 100mbps?
You could bond two interfaces on RB433AH:
http://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/Manual:Interface/Bonding
 
edmidor
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Re: Best hardware options for office AP

Fri May 07, 2010 4:40 pm

Sounds interesting - how reliable is it?

I'm just wondering what are advantage of rb433ah vs. RouterStation Pro that costs almost half of that? No RouterOS, but it's a mere AP, not a router...

What I don't get is WTH MT doesn't put at least one GigE port on 411/433, it's 21st century unless I'm missing something!
How much cost increase would it cause, $2?

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