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taloot
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Mikrotik wireless facts "problems" <-- sorry

Tue May 09, 2006 2:18 am

very high ping rate compare to regular access point

regular 2 ms to 5 ms MT getting 50ms to 500ms

too many disconnection for the clients using laptop ((its been much much reduced in the latest version of MT))
signal not accurate from client side
MT both sides
i m getting -92 signal as i test its connected but getting 5 requested timed out and one reply it should work @ 11mbps accurding to atheros data sheet AR5006X


we neeed more more updates on wireless packages


once nstreme enable the links work great and fast


really we are in trubles guys

any client in -80 and lower signal he is getting 300ms and above delay why should that happend???? becouse atheros??? ar5006x


i tried a pci with ar5004 chipset for indoor enviroment also i m getting the same problem
the laptop is 3 meter from the MT box and im getting 50's ping rate

my laptop have ar5006x chipset

also i tried CPE with marvell chipset with the same problem


fainlly i knows that MT have problems on the drivers
diffrent clients diffrent mini-pci using pci regular pc
diffrent vonders different setting i tried eveery thing

please guys do somthing
Last edited by taloot on Thu May 25, 2006 8:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
jarosoup
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Tue May 09, 2006 2:52 am

You haven't said anything about the AP hardware...what are you using? Sounds like interference, bad RF cables/antenna, or bad radio...
 
taloot
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Tue May 09, 2006 4:40 am

i hope so

i m using RB112 also regular pc
for the cables i buy it from mikrotik and i have cables from japaness company all the same
Chipset i ues 5004 <-- pci and i did ues AR5006x mini-pci senao and sparklan

the client
i try many client even mikrotik as station WDS
 
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Alessio Garavano
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Tue May 09, 2006 9:34 am

I am totally in agreement with you, also with atheros 5006x I am having many problems(i try 3 cards NMP-8602+ 26db), mainly if the configuration of tx-power is more high than 19db, the RB512(i try 3 RB512 with FW 1.12 and OS 2.9.23) it reinitiated continuously… I must disabled the card inmediatly by console or until having to retire the card to not reboot and have access to the router and recover a previous backup with low tx-power…
What is the problem? at a long time ago too many users are having serious problems with Mikrotik and theses cards!
Please :wink:
Thanks!
Alessio
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http://www.isparg.com.ar
 
taloot
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Tue May 09, 2006 10:13 pm

Mikrotik Game over.. contunie YES I no........ no
after lossing 6 of my clients when i start using mikrotik and atheros card fainlly i decide to reinstall my old AP with 1 watt amp



to be honst mikrotik is good as p2p with nstreme enabled but to make it function as regular ap its not good as i think
high ping time
extensive data loss then disconnected very low signal compare to old AP i m using 400mw mini-pci
 
odie
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Tue May 09, 2006 10:30 pm

i think gyys - that you have some serious config problems
here those boxes work really fine
maybe try to find the mistakes before criticising somebody else

if these boxes are as bad as you guys do then really nobody in the world would use them.....

think it over !!
 
jarosoup
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Tue May 09, 2006 11:34 pm

You still haven't said what card you are using other than the chipset it uses. If you are using a brand new Senao card or similar that has just become available, you can't really blame Mikrotik for it not working as other proven cards, as it probably hasn't been tested and "officially" support yet. Just because it has a supported chipset doesn't mean the card itself is fully supported. Just because it's got higher transmit rate doesn't mean it's going to work better...
 
valens
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Wed May 10, 2006 1:06 am

I was not trying to use many type of cards. I love CM9 and R52, and they works very good for me.
 
taloot
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Wed May 10, 2006 1:19 am

ok what do you prefer guys cm9 or r52 to test
 
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Equis
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Wed May 10, 2006 1:36 am

Hello,

I am using .23 and cm9's both ends on P2MP.

My Radio will stay connected with as low as with -90 (if they have to)

I think with CM9 this RouterOS is very good.

I do agree still more work to be done, but for me 99.9 is fine..
Last edited by Equis on Wed May 10, 2006 4:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
wildbill442
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Wed May 10, 2006 4:31 am

Well.. The subject is bogus cause there are no facts stated in your original post. We use MT for all our AP's and through multiple hops 16+ miles pings are sub 10ms..

I think you need a lesson in RF, and network design.. It might help to read the manual and benchmark the systems before deploying as well. You can't fault the product for misconfiguration and poor application.
 
taloot
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Wed May 10, 2006 6:06 am

i hope so wildbil now also i m about to buy R52 mini-pci just to make sure
btw all ppl say mis confige mis confige what do you mean is it nuclear bomb to make????
just as regular access point or even easier,, ok to be honst i didnt try thr cm9 and the r52,,,
come on guys i test it into indoor envirment and outdoor
as i said before its great when p2p with nstreme


you know wait did i post this problem thing ?????? just to make mikrotik take more care about wireless,,,,,

also for the mini-pci you can ues windows driver for all of the atheros vonders generic one i mean it works great


anyone post his ping from p2p @ 11g for 5 km link and compare it to regular ip
on 11g we are getting 1ms stable max is 3 ms in MT we are getting 1ms 15 ms 200ms 150ms is this my fault??
i post my confige already in previoes post but no one reply or lets call it no one find answer for the problem noise is -104
i m client with mikrotik since 2.8.xx and i like them very much but im having not problem its trubles

ok you can just told me what i did wrong in my link
i m always reading the manul and the forum looking for answers also having some guys on the msn messanger

mr wildbill442 setting up link with omni antenna p2mp signal is --80/-83 the ping is above 200ms when its ideal i think i should take lessons to make the link doing 1ms huh,,, can you make it wildbill???!!
 
wildbill442
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Wed May 10, 2006 7:54 am

Well first off -92dB is a horrible signal. The noise floor measures out of band interference meaning everything outside of the current band you are using (ie: 2.4Ghz). It doesn't take in account for other AP's in the area running in the same band. At least that's what I've got from previous threads on this forum, and I believe a MT rep confirmed this.


REF: http://forum.mikrotik.com/viewtopic.php ... oise+floor


In an ideal environment atheros cards claim to operate at these lower Rx sensitivities, and I've seen them perform well at lower signal levels in rural areas with realitively low RF interference. However it all depends on the environment, and 2.4GHz is really crowded. We strive for -75dB or better for our 2.4GHz wireless installations. Anything worse than that leaves you with little fade margin and the possibility of poor performance down the road. We've noticed the 5.8GHz band works much better and with the Ubiquiti SR5's we can achieve high throughput with very poor signals (high 80's to low 90's).


Here's some questions for you that will help you get the answers you need...


What's the total EIRP of your AP in dB (include the radio and antenna gain)?

What are you using for client devices (laptop cards, Fixed CPE device, etc..) and what is their respective EIRP's?

What band are you operating in? I saw you mention 802.11g, I hope you're not trying to use this in an outdoor environment over long distances...

What type of application is this? (hotspot, fixed point to multipoint wireless, point to point, etc..)

Post your entire config omitting unnecessary data (such as public IP addresses), to do this open a terminal to the MT AP and type "export file=filename". To retrieve this file you have to FTP to the MT box, open it in a text editor and paste in the forum.

Also it's good to post hardware information and RouterOS version as I see you've done in a previous post.


The problem you're describing sounds more like a physical or data link layer issue. The poor ping times could be attributed to the poor signal quality. Have you tried connecting at a closer proximity with a better signal, and do you still experience the same latency issues?


The more information you provide and in a more organized manor will help people HELP you.


Also I'd stick with the CM9's, Ubiquiti SR5/2, R52's, and other proven cards. Prism based chipsets work, but lack some features like WDS. I tend to stay away from any of the SENAO products, as I haven't had a chance to test them, and wasn't impressed with gear I've used in the past from that company.

I've also run into issues with atheros based chipsets mainly the SR2's and older Prism cards not performing well together, such as high latency and random disconnects. Using newer CPE devices seem to work better.

-Bill
 
taloot
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Wed May 10, 2006 3:01 pm

hello wild thanks for your rich reply,
will provide you the exact info once i installed cm9 card
really big thank tto you
 
Jrslick22
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Wed May 17, 2006 10:20 am

I have MT running over 60+ Km and get 3-5ms pings, i also have 50 clients hanging off 1 200mw card without any probs, MT's Rock
 
durim
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Wed May 17, 2006 3:07 pm

I have about 3 ptp 40+km running with mikrotik cm9 and r52 and with singnal -82 I am able to pass 10Mbps and, 50 clients in urban area in quit noisy ambient working good with rb532 as AP and R52 cards .
 
taloot
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Wed May 17, 2006 3:19 pm

its very good to hear that?
anyone using R52 could please give me the following info?
CHIP info my 200mw AR5006
mac:0xa/0x5, phy:0x61, a5:0x63, a2:0x0, eeprom:0x5003
senao chip info
mac:0xa/0x4, phy:0x61, a5:0x63, a2:0x0, eeprom:0x5002
 
onowojemma
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Signal strenght

Mon May 22, 2006 7:27 pm

Please i want to know if signal strenght of -60 is much better than that of -86?
Thanks
Mikrotik! making networking easy
 
durim
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Re: Signal strenght

Mon May 22, 2006 10:50 pm

Please i want to know if signal strenght of -60 is much better than that of -86?
Thanks
yes - 60 is much beter than -86 the lover it is is beter .
 
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normis
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Tue May 23, 2006 12:39 pm

actually `minus 62` is higher than `minus 82`, think of it like a thermometer scale.
 
onowojemma
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Tue May 23, 2006 4:15 pm

Thanks for the reply,please is there a way i can change to the config to improve the signal strenght
Mikrotik! making networking easy
 
jober
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Tue May 23, 2006 6:04 pm

actually `minus 62` is higher than `minus 82`, think of it like a thermometer scale.
Hold up there! What are you saying? You are going to confuse some people.
If you are going to use that analogy you should add "The cooler it is the better". 8)
:lol:
 
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normis
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Wed May 24, 2006 9:27 am

now you are confusing people, these kinds of jokes should be banned :)

so, about signal strenght:

-100 will not work
-90 is too bad
-70 is kind'a fine
-60 is good
-50 is very good
-40 is too good to be true
Last edited by normis on Wed May 24, 2006 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Beccara
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Wed May 24, 2006 10:49 am

too good? care to explain to the non-rf eng's here why having a signal of -40 is too good
 
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normis
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Wed May 24, 2006 10:54 am

it means that it is so good that you can't even believe it.
 
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djape
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Wed May 24, 2006 12:25 pm

-40 is too good to be true
:D @ normis

@ taloot Now, two cents from me:
Mikrotik is fine OS and properly configured it can do much more than regular AP's. High pings are caused by noise so check for interference or use prism cards which are not that sensitive to noise as Atheros, but consider that prism can't give you performance as Atheros...

Cheers all...
I drink like a pirate and smoke like a hippie...
 
taloot
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Thu May 25, 2006 8:14 pm

sorry MT fainly i found the problem from where it comes


NMP-8602 <---------- its the problem creator
when using wireless package the max TX power is 23 db
but when i ues the legacy it goes for 26 db

test done on p2p link 5 km distance with 18db yagi antennas bothsides
now i m having 5ms to 10ms stable ping omni-to-omni WDS AP bothsides
(sure once i removed the senao ) i have a link with senao p2p with -77/-77 the link is only 300-500 kbps
i removed it and i uesd another cards brand lower power the signal is -81/-82 the speed is 5.5 Mbps for send and 4.9Mbps for recive
what a big mess i put my self into
 
nswizard
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Sat May 27, 2006 8:21 pm

Hello!
I have, let's say a same situation.
For 1 year we used a soekris board and MT 2.9.6 as AP Bridge with cm9 (a standard) and Prism 2.5 200mW (b standard) on a client side.
We had to upgrade for a faster cpu and since there is no pcmci slots in new board we purhased 200mw mini pci atheros b/g card.
Now I can't ping some clients with packets more than 256k even if signal is around -60 and client devices are connected in highest rate. And in G standard nothing works. I tried all advised settings for atheros cards and diferent freq.
ack is around 30 and sometimes goes to 380. Links are between 500m and 3km.

When 200mW Atheros card is switched with 100mW Prism 2.5 card signal for the same clients is -70 to -80 but 1024 bytes ping are 10ms with 5% loss max.

Have some ideas??
 
taloot
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Sat May 27, 2006 11:25 pm

from my experinces with atheros cards,
there is many many windows version for the driver many bugs the fixing
XR
i was having my pc being restarted the atheros drivers updated usually for windows

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