Good day

I'm curious why can't I change antenna-gain
I know it is described here https://help.mikrotik.com/docs/display/ROS/WiFi
> This setting cannot override the antenna gain to be lower than the minimum antenna gain of a radio.
No default value.

What if I use long feeder cables? How can I compensate attenuation?

And why it is rounded up as according to https://mikrotik.com/product/hap_ac3
Antenna gain dBi for 5 GHz 5.5
?

Any rumours about frequency-mode: manual-txpower or whatever it could be called in the future for experiments in wifi-qcom-ac package?

Hi !

Yes, the documentations are correct. Since WifiWave2 drivers appeared it is like this, it is fixed to your country regulations. You can set only lower output (higher number). Regarding to my knowledges the antenna gain is calculated and automatically set/corrected according to mentioned regulations. For those reasons i dont see any chance for manual tx power/superchannel/no_country_set or "whatever", since it goes against laws and the manufacturer has to follow them.

What if I use long feeder cables? How can I compensate attenuation?

Minimum antenna gain is only fixed for devices with permanently attached antennas. Devices, which only have antenna connectors and one has to use external antennas, don't have it set (or they have it set to 0).

I don't think that use case where antena feeder losses are greater than antenna gain (so combined they are less than 0dBi) is a realistic one.

Minimum antenna gain is only fixed for devices with permanently attached antennas. Devices, which only have antenna connectors and one has to use external antennas, don't have it set (or they have it set to 0).

As you can see that is not true. hAP ac³ has detachable antennas but stock antenna gain hardcoded into firmware (according to what I can see). Developers assume one will never attach antennas with lower gain or have losses in feeder lines?

Hi !

Yes, the documentations are correct. Since WifiWave2 drivers appeared it is like this, it is fixed to your country regulations. You can set only lower output (higher number). Regarding to my knowledges the antenna gain is calculated and automatically set/corrected according to mentioned regulations. For those reasons i dont see any chance for manual tx power/superchannel/no_country_set or "whatever", since it goes against laws and the manufacturer has to follow them.

So WifiWave2 drivers written not by Mikrotik? As wireless package have all this features. I think antenna gain just hardcoded into firmware.
I'm asking because wifi-qcom-ac and wifi-qcom packages look really unstable and a lot could change in the future. Packages was split because lack of space to put all the required features already.

Calm down. No need for wifi-qcom-ac bashing.
Even on legacy wireless you weren't able to set antenna-gain below the value of the physical built-in antenna.
So yep, hardcoded by device probably. There are no outside connectors for the antennas on that particular device, so why should MT support it? Just because someone likes to replace directly attached antennas on the board?

Calm down. No need for wifi-qcom-ac bashing.
Even on legacy wireless you weren't able to set antenna-gain below the value of the physical built-in antenna.
So yep, hardcoded by device probably. There are no outside connectors for the antennas on that particular device, so why should MT support it? Just because someone likes to replace directly attached antennas on the board?

The antenna-gain parameter makes no difference when you put full power on the output. What I understood from reading forums (including this one) is that antenna-gain parameter value truncated from regulatory domain max power allowed and that would be transmitter max power:
<radio tx power> = <MAX allowed by regulatory domain> - <antenna-gain>

Are we talking about the same device? hAP ac3 has detachable antennas

"hAP ac3" and "hAP ac3 LTE" are different devices

"hAP ac3" and "hAP ac3 LTE" are different devices

But OP expressly pointed to the "hap ac3" page?
And in post #4 he is lamenting that the value is fixed even if the device has detachable antennas?

Yes, but this device is an indoor device and is certified only for indoor use, this is why such restrictions are there. Normally people want to set lower gain than the actual antenna that is uses, to force higher TX power. This is not allowed.

I see, so, to recap, and if I get it right, two conditions must be true:
1) the device has external antenna connector
2) the device has been certified/approved/whatever (also) for outdoor use
to allow the final user to set freely the antenna gain, otherwise the lower limit is that of the antenna shipped with the device (and presumably part of the certification).
In this process, due to rounding (or for whatever other reason), 6-5.5=0.5 dB are lost forever.

hum, what if someone likes to attach 2dbi antennas instead? Sure, possible. But one has to live with weaker tx-power than would be allowed?

Now what legitimate use case would that be?

Now what legitimate use case would that be?

- Low-gain directional antennas
- Long transmission antenna lines (extension cables)
- New antennas are more beautiful (we are talking about SOHO indoor devices)

So If I understood this trend correctly all future MT routers will have fixed antennas like most SOHO routers on the market have? Because there is no legitimate use case to change them.

hAP series are not designed for any of that. We have M series devices for DIY projects like that.

Me confused. Does hAP ac3 forcefully apply antenna-gain=6 on ROS7 for some countries, but not for others, and this is supposedly intended behavior? Or is it forcefully applied for all countries? Is this the case regardless of factory firmware version?

Now what legitimate use case would that be?

Replace the 5.5dbi antenna with an e.g. 2.5dbi one to change characteristics of coverage. I did not know that I had to explain that.

Why? Get the smaller device if the wifi coverage is "too good"

Well, changing antennas to weaker but more omnidirectional seems like the only legitimate way to take advantage of the detachable antennas, you know, at least with a device that is "certified only for indoor use".

hAP series are not designed for any of that. We have M series devices for DIY projects like that.

M series? Maybe you mean this RouterBOARD DIY section https://mikrotik.com/products/group/routerboard?
Unfortunately boards there have 1-3 wired port options which is not enough. RB450Gx4 has no radio options
And in Interfaces https://mikrotik.com/products/group/interfaces section there are no 802.11ax adapters.

Why? Get the smaller device if the wifi coverage is "too good"

Ehem ... smaller antenna gain - stronger radio power .... is to my knowledge and verified with experiments a very valuable setup for indoor use.

There are many reflections indoors, so total radio energy matters as the transmission path/direction is unknown. That allowed combined energy level (TX power) is higher with low antenna gain setup.
High antenna gain does not add energy to the radiated radio waves. Passive antennna , like the ones used here, do not add energy to the signal, it is only bundled in a smaller area.
Legislation will cap the max power in the strongest direction, so make it lower than the legal limit for all other directions. This makes lower collective radiated power.