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holvoetn
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Fri Jan 17, 2025 9:08 pm

Finally support hinting Detect Internet is no good :lol:
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Fri Jan 17, 2025 10:32 pm

that works for you! :)
Mikrotk answered me by mail
Please check these items in interface settings.

Image
Thanks!

Been there, done that. Didn't help :)
I'm also actively troubleshooting this with support. Probably sent 20+ .rif files. And so far it looks like it is a combination of ROS > 7.14.3 and Google Nest Hubs/Speakers that breaks Mikrotik WIFI intermittently. The more Nest devices I have connected, the worse it gets.
Last edited by mndtrp on Sat Jan 18, 2025 7:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
jimmys01
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Fri Jan 17, 2025 10:44 pm

The more Nest devices I have connected, the worse it gets.
I have like a billion IT devices connected. But those are working fine, just my xiaomi phones have the issue.
 
litvcom
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 18, 2025 1:27 am

I see that 7.17 has been released and I immediately decided to check this thread to see if anything has been fixed. And I understand that there are no changes. Oh, cool.
 
Jef61
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 18, 2025 2:03 pm

I'm also actively troubleshooting this with support. Probably sent 20+ .rif files. And so far it looks like it is a combination of ROS > 7.14.3 and Google Nest Hubs/Speakers that breaks Mikrotik WIFI intermittently. The more Nest devices I have connected, the worse it gets.

Yes, I have 4 Google Nest Speakers and only with version 7.14.3 the WiFi is stable.
But I have given up, bought AP's from another vendor, rock stable now.
 
mman1982
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 18, 2025 8:14 pm

Experiencing the same problem with 7.16 with CapXL ac and Cap ac too. Before upgrade it.worked with the same devices/phones..
 
pfyod
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Jan 21, 2025 6:17 pm

I do not have google nest speakers, but I do have 3 xiaomi google home speakers and I also experience wifi instability (and "SA Query timeout" spam in logs) with anything newer than 7.14.3.

From v7.18beta2 changelog:
*) wifi - avoid excessive re-transmission of SA Query action frames;
Anyone brave enough to try to see if it fixes things?
 
vaskoss
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Jan 21, 2025 6:19 pm

7.18 beta

*) wifi - avoid excessive re-transmission of SA Query action frames

It's worth a try ?
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Jan 21, 2025 7:10 pm

7.18 beta

*) wifi - avoid excessive re-transmission of SA Query action frames

It's worth a try ?
Why not :)

Testing now. 12+ hours in. There is no noticeable improvement, still get simultaneous packet drops while pinging Google Nest Speakers and other Chromecast enabled devices.

*Edited multiple times. Things looked good in the beginning, but the issues returned after adding the Google Nest Speakers and other Chromecast enabled devices to my HAP ax2. Got confirmation from MK support that my issue is not addressed in beta2 release.
Last edited by mndtrp on Wed Jan 22, 2025 3:34 pm, edited 3 times in total.
 
alibloke
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Jan 22, 2025 1:37 am

WPA3 + fast roaming works for me now
 
arnisfreimanis
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Jan 22, 2025 7:24 pm

Same here. A lot of connection losts of all kind of devices (mainly random PC's, phones). I saw somewhere that WPA2 without management protection could help as a tmp solution, but that either does not work for me. And the worst thing is that I bought 7 wAP AX for a client and there is no way to roll back to 7.14.x as the factory firmware is something like 7.15.x :(
 
alibloke
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Jan 22, 2025 8:13 pm

Have you tried setting connection-priority = 0/1?

What about rOS 7.18b2? There are several wifi improvements there.
 
arnisfreimanis
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Jan 22, 2025 10:06 pm

Yes, connection priority 0/1 and today upgraded to beta, still the same. However, I think it was worse before the upgrade.
 
vmsh0
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Thu Jan 23, 2025 12:04 pm

I'm seeing this on the hAP ax3, can confirm that latest beta doesn't fix. If MikroTik support thinks I could help in some way, I ask them to please contact me.

I have a thread here: viewtopic.php?p=1120829
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Thu Jan 23, 2025 12:06 pm

I'm seeing this on the hAP ax3, can confirm that latest beta doesn't fix. If MikroTik support thinks I could help in some way, I ask them to please contact me.
Create supout file and share with support.

Meanwhile, please feel free to share your config to have a sanity check on it:
/export file=anynameyoulike
Remove serial and any other pirvate info, post ebtween code tags by using the </> button.
 
pfyod
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Thu Jan 23, 2025 5:22 pm

@arnisfreimanis: do you also have google nest / home / chromecast devices in your network?
 
MichalPospichal
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Fri Jan 24, 2025 7:48 pm

I attempted to isolate the problem and done many configuration tests, but with no success.

I am able to easily replicate the issue within a few minutes with ONLY 2 devices connected - my phone Moto Edge30 Fusion and WiiM Mini streamer (this one does NOT have chromecast functionality). cAP ax, I only had 5GHz radio active, single SSID with basic default wifi config (apart from group key update of 1H), with WPA2 PSK only, and CCMP ciphers/group encryption.
WiiM is streaming a radio, and within a few minutes it starts to drop out, at which moment my phone disconnects and reconnects with SA query timeout. This periodically repeats several times an hour.

If I add Wiim Ultra streamer to the mix, I get the same dropouts on either of the streamers even without the phone connected, so in this case when Mini is streaming, Ultra disconnects and Mini drops the audio out for a moment. And vice versa, basically the device that is currently streaming does not seem to disconnect but it clearly loses connection for a short time and the idle device disconnects/reconnects.
If there is only 1 device connected it seems to be stable, at least for a few hours, from what I tested. It is like 2+ devices connected at the same time cannot stand each other.

I understand there are people that have no issues with new WiFi qc drivers, but this problem is so widely reported by many people that it cannot be a configuration error, more so when in 7.14 it reportedly works fine. Mikrotik should really look into this in priority, because there must be some serious problem somewhere.
(btw I also created a ticket and provided my suport.rif file).
 
grzegorzb
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 25, 2025 2:44 pm

Unfortunately, I have already lost hope of fixing the WiFi disconnection problem. After all, the problem has been known for more than a year and Mikrotik does nothing about it. Instead, it offers a useless winbox 4 and other “gadgets” and the reported problems remain uncorrected. This is a pity, because other equipment manufacturers such as Tp-Link benefit from this. In the past, in hotels, guesthouses and other public premises, the majority of WiFi network was implemented by Mikrotik, but now I see Omada equipment being installed in its place. No one professionally dealing with networks will push for the problems that Mikrotik guarantees.
Last edited by grzegorzb on Sat Jan 25, 2025 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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infabo
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 25, 2025 2:50 pm

It seems you've accidentally pasted your comment twice. That said, desktop application development (such as Winbox) and web development (like the Webfig redesign) are entirely separate disciplines from software development for embedded devices (such as those running RouterOS on MikroTik hardware). These efforts do not interfere with one another. My 2 cents.
 
arnisfreimanis
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 25, 2025 6:43 pm

@arnisfreimanis: do you also have google nest / home / chromecast devices in your network?
Nope, none of that.
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Jan 25, 2025 9:48 pm

Unfortunately, I have already lost hope of fixing the WiFi disconnection problem.
Did you have a look at the past changelogs?
After all, the problem has been known for more than a year and Mikrotik does nothing about it.
v7.14.3 was introduced April the 17th, 2024. After this release, a new(er) driver of Qualcom was introduced that caused problems for some users. Have been there, did a lot of tweaking and have zero problems currently using v7.18beta2 (and the same since all 7.16.x versions there were made available).
In the past, in hotels, guesthouses and other public premises, the majority of WiFi network was implemented by Mikrotik, but now I see Omada equipment being installed in its place. No one professionally dealing with networks will push for the problems that Mikrotik guarantees.
Can you please provide numbers?

To be honest, a new user with only 2 posts saying it has lost faith...either provide some constructive feedback or request for help. But stop complaining and talking about other brand(s).
 
pfyod
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 8:29 am

v7.14.3 was introduced April the 17th, 2024. After this release, a new(er) driver of Qualcom was introduced that caused problems for some users. Have been there, did a lot of tweaking and have zero problems currently using v7.18beta2 (and the same since all 7.16.x versions there were made available).
Good for you. There are plenty of people here for whom the only fix that works is a rollback to 17.4.3. Someone posted above that they can reproduce the issue with a fresh / default config and just two devices. The "I just switched off WPA3 / set connect priority / ... and it works for me, don't know what y'all talking about!" crowd is just distracting from the real issue.
 
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infabo
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 8:44 am

It would be beneficial to all to report these issues to Mikrotik support - instead on whining here. This is a community topic. Of course there will be comments like "I dont have this issue" just because this is not a Mikrotik support thread. It is a open discussion.
 
arnisfreimanis
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 9:05 am

v7.14.3 was introduced April the 17th, 2024. After this release, a new(er) driver of Qualcom was introduced that caused problems for some users. Have been there, did a lot of tweaking and have zero problems currently using v7.18beta2 (and the same since all 7.16.x versions there were made available).
So.. where was the problem? How to tweak things right?
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:00 am

I'm not saying this is "right", at least it is working perfectly for me:
# 2025-01-27 08:41:54 by RouterOS 7.18beta2
# software id = 3EBJ-1MI6
#
# model = RB4011iGS+
# serial number = #############
/interface wifi channel
add band=2ghz-ax disabled=no frequency=2412,2437,2462 name=CHAN-2G \
    reselect-interval=18h..1d skip-dfs-channels=10min-cac width=20mhz
add band=5ghz-ax disabled=no frequency=5250-5710 name=CHAN-5G \
    reselect-interval=4h..8h skip-dfs-channels=10min-cac width=20/40/80mhz
/interface wifi datapath
add bridge=bridge-LAN disabled=no name=Datapath vlan-id=1
/interface wifi security
add authentication-types=wpa2-psk connect-priority=0/1 disabled=no ft=yes \
    ft-over-ds=yes multi-passphrase-group=SSID name=SSID-PPSK wps=disable
/interface wifi configuration
add channel=CHAN-2G country=Netherlands datapath=Datapath disabled=no \
    dtim-period=3 mode=ap multicast-enhance=enabled name=SSID-CONF-2G \
    security=SSID-PPSK ssid=SSID tx-power=9
add channel=CHAN-5G country=Netherlands datapath=Datapath disabled=no \
    dtim-period=3 mode=ap multicast-enhance=enabled name=SSID-CONF-5G \
    security=SSID-PPSK ssid=SSID tx-power=24
/interface wifi capsman
set ca-certificate=auto enabled=yes interfaces=MGT-VLAN package-path=\
    /packages require-peer-certificate=no upgrade-policy=none
/interface wifi provisioning
add action=create-dynamic-enabled disabled=no master-configuration=\
    SSID-CONF-5G name-format=%I supported-bands=5ghz-ax
add action=create-dynamic-enabled disabled=no master-configuration=\
    SSID-CONF-2G name-format=%I supported-bands=2ghz-ax
/interface wifi security multi-passphrase
add disabled=no group=SSID isolation=no passphrase=passphrase-50 vlan-id=50
add disabled=no group=SSID isolation=yes passphrase=passphrase-51 vlan-id=51
For context:
Two VLAN's, ID 50 for home and ID 51 for Guest.
PPSK to have a single SSID, WPA2-PSK as that is only supported for PPSK:
https://help.mikrotik.com/docs/spaces/R ... properties
For fast roaming ft=yes and ft-over-ds=yes (for devices that support FT) and connect-priority=0/1 for those who don't.
Devices are (all the usual) brands like Samsung, Apple, Noika, HP, Microsoft, Dell, etc.
There are three wAP AX CAP's (but also working just fine for cAP AX).
 
lubomirs
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:41 am

"...authentication-types=wpa2-psk..."

I don't want to use WPA2. . .
Last edited by lubomirs on Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:42 am

v7.14.3 was introduced April the 17th, 2024. After this release, a new(er) driver of Qualcom was introduced that caused problems for some users. Have been there, did a lot of tweaking and have zero problems currently using v7.18beta2 (and the same since all 7.16.x versions there were made available).
Good for you. There are plenty of people here for whom the only fix that works is a rollback to 17.4.3. Someone posted above that they can reproduce the issue with a fresh / default config and just two devices. The "I just switched off WPA3 / set connect priority / ... and it works for me, don't know what y'all talking about!" crowd is just distracting from the real issue.
7.18beta also has no improvement for you? then your issue might be caused by something completely different.
from this topic we have seen many people who join in on the "me too", but the issue was related to something else.
please make a full report of the issue with RIF file from 7.18beta, logs from client device, etc. and email to support@mikrotik.com
 
maigonis
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Jan 28, 2025 2:49 pm

I tested again wap ax as STA on latest beta, still get deauth frames (beta on all MT devices). As I get random reason codes, I'm trying to collect them all (for fun).

Test was exactly the same as mentioned is SUP-174626 ticket, connection session was active about 6 days.
image.png
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blondasek
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Feb 03, 2025 1:10 am

[...]
I found the reason for the loss of signal in all gadgets with a router. Private wi-fi address mode was enabled on iphone settings in static address mode. Turning off this mode doesn't result in loss of signal from the router during two day. Additionally turned off Wi-Fi Assist mode in cellular data.

true
As result when STA receives deauth frame it actually leaves AP as 802.11 standards require, and we get log entry "connection lost", or "sa query timeout" on AP. This affects all wave2 lineup devices afaik.
I have reported this to support.
EDIT:
unfortunately it did not fix the problem. Still dropping the signal. Waiting for Mikrotik action.
 
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Larsa
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Feb 03, 2025 1:10 pm

@blondasek, @maigonis - This is just a user forum. If you haven't already, please email a support.rif to support@mikrotik.com.
 
KindlyMan
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Feb 15, 2025 12:47 pm

@blondasek, @maigonis - This is just a user forum. If you haven't already, please email a support.rif to support@mikrotik.com.
I sent them files three times, and they gave me recommendations on some settings. I made them, but the problem was not solved.
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Feb 15, 2025 1:07 pm

I sent them files three times, and they gave me recommendations on some settings. I made them, but the problem was not solved.
Have you shared your config here on the forum already? Would like to have a look at it, if possible.
 
mman1982
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Sat Feb 15, 2025 2:28 pm

It seems 7.18beta6 solved for me,after 1 days usage looks like it works.



Good for you. There are plenty of people here for whom the only fix that works is a rollback to 17.4.3. Someone posted above that they can reproduce the issue with a fresh / default config and just two devices. The "I just switched off WPA3 / set connect priority / ... and it works for me, don't know what y'all talking about!" crowd is just distracting from the real issue.
7.18beta also has no improvement for you? then your issue might be caused by something completely different.
from this topic we have seen many people who join in on the "me too", but the issue was related to something else.
please make a full report of the issue with RIF file from 7.18beta, logs from client device, etc. and email to support@mikrotik.com
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm

It seems 7.18beta6 solved for me,after 1 days usage looks like it works.



7.18beta also has no improvement for you? then your issue might be caused by something completely different.
from this topic we have seen many people who join in on the "me too", but the issue was related to something else.
please make a full report of the issue with RIF file from 7.18beta, logs from client device, etc. and email to support@mikrotik.com
No improvement with the latest beta (7.18beta6).
https://imgur.com/a/iFbIkgI
All WIFI devices break simultaneously.
*SIGH*
And yes, I have been through the hoops with support with rif's.
 
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infabo
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Mon Feb 17, 2025 11:56 pm

I cant see much details on this low res screenshot, but: you seem to ping wifi-clients from AP. What is written in the log while timeout?
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 9:18 am

And yes, I have been through the hoops with support with rif's.
Could you give the netinstall hoop a try? Just to make sure that the device is clean from start?
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 10:04 am

I cant see much details on this low res screenshot, but: you seem to ping wifi-clients from AP. What is written in the log while timeout?
This is the what is logged related to wireless
https://imgur.com/a/SK5qpJL
*EDIT: None of the devices listed in the logs are the Google Cast devices that "falls off the network". And they keep their DHCP lease time. Meaning they are not disconnecting from WIFI, but the connectivity is still dropped (packet loss).

The error happen less if certain devices (Google Cast enabled) are "dormant". I.e. not streaming content to them.
If I remove the devices (Google Cast enabled) from my wireless network, then there are no issues.

All of this information with tons of details has been provided to MK support and the ticket is still active. Though it's been quiet from MK support for the last 3+ weeks.
Last edited by mndtrp on Tue Feb 18, 2025 3:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 10:04 am

And yes, I have been through the hoops with support with rif's.
Could you give the netinstall hoop a try? Just to make sure that the device is clean from start?
I have performed multiple netinstalls.And even tried with minimal "default" configuration. Still the same.
 
erlinden
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 10:39 am

I have performed multiple netinstalls.And even tried with minimal "default" configuration. Still the same.
Would you be so kind to share your config if not done already?
 
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infabo
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 11:10 am

What means "Google Cast enabled devices"? What kind of devices are these? You mean this all happens while casting e.g. Youtube from Android phone to your Android TV?
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:04 pm

What means "Google Cast enabled devices"? What kind of devices are these? You mean this all happens while casting e.g. Youtube from Android phone to your Android TV?
Using the following devices Google Nest Audio, Google Nest Mini, CCwGTV(4K), Harman Kardon Soundbar, Xiaomi MI Smart Speaker to stream content from Spotify, Netflix, MAX etc.
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 12:09 pm

I have performed multiple netinstalls.And even tried with minimal "default" configuration. Still the same.
Would you be so kind to share your config if not done already?
Thank you for asking, but I don't think it will shed any new light to this issue sharing a bare minimum device "default" configuration.
That type of configuration should "just work". And it does with RoS 7.14.3 and older.
 
pfyod
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 5:47 pm

@mndtrp: Have you tried explicitly disabling management-protection? It's "allowed" by default for WPA2 but can be set to "disabled". The only relevant thing about Chromecasts that I can find is linked to protected management frames. Has mikrotik support confirmed to you that they tested the issue with some Chromecast devices connected to wifi?

P.S. I have the same problem as you (lots of Chromecast devices, nothing never than 17.4.3 works) but no means to easily test different ROS versions.
 
MichalPospichal
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Tue Feb 18, 2025 11:32 pm

In addition to what I wrote here: viewtopic.php?t=198736&start=300#p1121487

When testing only 2 devices connected at a given time (WiiM Mini and Moto Edge Fusion 30) I realized, that the issue does not manifest when both devices are on different radios, that is WiiM Mini is on 2GHz and Moto on 5GHz, then it is perfectly stable.
Moto gets frequent random SA Query timeouts ONLY when both devices are on the same radio, and does not matter if 2G or 5G.

Not sure what to make of it, but to me it seems it cannot be some WiFi setting causing it, if if is abosutely fine when the clients are separated on different radios (with exactly the same WiFi settings) and fighting each other when connected on the same radio.

Maybe someone else knows more how exactly this works in ROS, from my point of view this must be something on driver or even HW level.
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Feb 19, 2025 8:09 am

@mndtrp: Have you tried explicitly disabling management-protection? It's "allowed" by default for WPA2 but can be set to "disabled". The only relevant thing about Chromecasts that I can find is linked to protected management frames. Has mikrotik support confirmed to you that they tested the issue with some Chromecast devices connected to wifi?

P.S. I have the same problem as you (lots of Chromecast devices, nothing never than 17.4.3 works) but no means to easily test different ROS versions.
Yes, I tested explicitly disabling management-protection with RoS 7.17rc2 and supplied supout.rif's to the ongoing support ticket I have with Mikrotik.
There was no difference in behavior with or without management-protection.

Starting to lose hope. As I opened the ticket late 2024 with a lot of back and forth testing multiple settings that Mikrotik support recommended. But now it has been quiet from support. No updates from their side for weeks and there are no relevant fixes in the current 7.18beta-rc releases.
 
pfyod
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Feb 19, 2025 9:10 am

What about putting the Chromecast devices on a separate virtual SSID?
 
mndtrp
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Feb 19, 2025 9:22 am

What about putting the Chromecast devices on a separate virtual SSID?
I have tried that. In addition to separate master interfaces 2.4 and 5. Same behavior.

This is also known to MikroTik support.
 
vic3apex
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Re: "not responding" - f.k.a. SA Query timeout

Wed Feb 19, 2025 10:13 am

The same issue viewtopic.php?t=208199