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mobilexpi
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RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 16, 2022 8:16 pm

Hi,
I hope you're doing well. I have a CCR1072 with v6.47.7 installed and was so frustrated with random reboots. I was wondering if anyone has upgraded their CCR1072 to v7.6 and how it performs. Do you still experience random reboots?

Best regards,
 
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chechito
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Dec 20, 2022 5:58 am

most the time ccr1072 random reboots come from a flawed implementation, so dont expect miracles from a version change

plenty of 1072 working flawlessly with 6.48.6, have not tryed v7.x on ccr1072 until today
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Dec 20, 2022 6:08 am

I read on other forum posts that users saw significant enough performance enhancements with RouterOS 7 installed on their 1072 that they upgraded their entire Tilera fleet. I had no problems on a couple of 1009's and decided to do the same on my biggest box, a 1036.

That box does CGNAT for 500 hosts at 2Gbps non-stop. The load was normally 3-5% on 6.47. After upgrading to 7.6, with the same exact workload the CPU has dropped to between 0-1%.

Use some of the new RouterOS 7-only features on Tilera with caution. For example, adding a VXLAN to a bridge will cause systematic reboots of a CCR1009 (reported on forums and I experienced it firsthand with two of them).
 
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NathanA
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Dec 20, 2022 10:39 am

I concur that if you have a 1072 that you are experiencing frequent reboots on, the hardware is usually faulty. On the 1072 routers we have that work flawlessly, we have no crashing/stability issues that can be traced to RouterOS 6.x.

There are a shocking number of faulty 1072s out there. Symptoms are frequent crashes under load and (often) showing incorrect amount of RAM (instead of 16GiB, it will show 4 / 8 / 12 GiB ...and sometimes this number will change if rebooted).

If out of warranty, MikroTik used to repair these for a fee. The last one that we sent to them with this fault, they sent back as "unrepairable" (refused to touch it, even if we paid them to do so!). Specifically, they claimed that the "damage was caused by overvoltage and the warranty was voided", which is ridiculous on a number of levels since 1. the device was outside of warranty anyway and we were willing to pay for repair service, 2. 1072 has built-in AC/DC transformers that would have protected the motherboard from "overvoltage" (if there was a power surge, I would have expected the power supplies to die, not the mainboard or CPU), 3. it sounds like like they were blaming us for the "overvoltage".

In fact, they followed up that response with a question: "Do we know if the customer was using the correct voltage poe?"

WHAT? The 1072 doesn't even use PoE. Why the #$#@$% would MT support be asking us about whether we were using the "correct" PoE voltage to power this defective 1072?? *sigh*

1072s are awesome when they work, but as far as MikroTik hardware goes, they are apparently an extremely "delicate flower" that can fail if you look at them the wrong way.

(Frankly, I suspect that most 1072s with these problems were defective from the factory. In the case of the ones we have sent back for repair out of warranty, they had been problematic for a long time, and it wasn't until I ran tests and read posts on the forums here about others with similar issues that I realized that the crashing ones were actually physically defective, and probably were defective from day 1. So extremely extremely frustrating that MT now will not even repair them out of warranty. There goes USD$3,000 down the drain...)
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Wed Dec 21, 2022 10:55 am

I concur that if you have a 1072 that you are experiencing frequent reboots on, the hardware is usually faulty. On the 1072 routers we have that work flawlessly, we have no crashing/stability issues that can be traced to RouterOS 6.x.
Has there been some sort of consensus what is actually wrong with some of these ? As you say some from day 1 gave us non stop issues.We had to retire them and replace with ubnts.
I have 3x 1072 doorstops at the office.
Weird how the 1016's and 1032's just pretty much work forever.Our failure rate on the r2's of those are lower than the +50k HP,Dell,PAN and Sophos equipment our clients use.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Thu Dec 22, 2022 4:28 pm

Has there been some sort of consensus what is actually wrong with some of these ? As you say some from day 1 gave us non stop issues.We had to retire them and replace with ubnts.
I have 3x 1072 doorstops at the office.
Weird how the 1016's and 1032's just pretty much work forever.Our failure rate on the r2's of those are lower than the +50k HP,Dell,PAN and Sophos equipment our clients use.
No one outside of MikroTik would know for sure. But given the number of other threads that turn up if you search for 1072 RAM or crash or instability, it sure seems like poor manufacturing yields and quality assurance. Either that or they "test" fine after assembly, but something isn't quite right & a solder joint or board trace or something gets broken during transit/shipment? Who knows...

viewtopic.php?t=121489
viewtopic.php?t=125326
viewtopic.php?t=144945
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Thu Dec 22, 2022 10:55 pm

i think MikroTik Lack of validated network design guidelines is the main reason of ccr1072 deployment miscarriages

i have "rescued" several docens of ccr1072 which were at doorstops

i think in most cases misconceptions about product scaling drove customers toward flawed network designs

have been a work of years to know how to sucessfully deploy ccr1072

unfortunately in some cases is not easy to change network design to acommodate it to the restrictions imposed by each product
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:09 am

i think MikroTik Lack of validated network design guidelines is the main reason of ccr1072 deployment miscarriages

i have "rescued" several docens of ccr1072 which were at doorstops

i think in most cases misconceptions about product scaling drove customers toward flawed network designs
`
We are talking about two completely different things.

Underperformance due to not understanding the product and its limitations is one thing.

Random reboots all the time is another completely different thing. There can only be two conclusions you can arrive at after experiencing such an event: a software bug, or a hardware fault.

The original poster was running 6.47.x, which is "new" enough in the 6.x series that it is fairly mature. I certainly do not see known-good CCR1072 units randomly rebooting themselves when running recent 6.x code on them, regardless of configuration.

And there are definitely defective 1072s out there. The threads that I linked to CLEARLY show a hardware fault. CCR1072 should NEVER show a total RAM number other than 16GiB. And there are an uncomfortable number of reports from an awful lot of people.

In my experience, these faulty/defective 1072s can experience instability or incorrect RAM count...and often both go hand-in-hand. The last unit that we tried to RMA will sometimes show all 16GiB when booted, and sometimes show less. And if I reset it to defaults, and then initiate "/tool bandwidth-test 127.0.0.1", it will crash and reboot itself in 5 minutes or less. A different 1072 that I take off the shelf and perform the exact same test on with the exact same RouterOS version absolutely does not crash when I bandwidth-test to loopback. It just absolutely should not happen. So the hardware in this particular unit is clearly faulty...which MikroTik themselves confirmed when they analyzed it and then blamed us for killing it with "overvoltage" (not true).

And this is not the only 1072 we have witnessed these kinds of symptoms on. It is shockingly common, leading me to think that there is a high manufacturing defect rate on these things.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 2:03 am

that issue of different memory ram size looks like a faulty ram channel or channels

i have only one case a ccr1072 with showing only 8gb of ram, the interesting thing is that the damn router works ok, but has a light load (6gbps of traffic), no performance problems either

i think is interesting to share experiences with this routers, together we can improve the sucess for every user of RouterBoards, being aware of situations where problems are more prone to arise
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 2:31 am

i have only one case a ccr1072 with showing only 8gb of ram, the interesting thing is that the damn router works ok, but has a light load (6gbps of traffic), no performance problems either
`
Yes acknowledged, like I said we have experienced 1072s that sometimes only have faulty memory count (but are stable), or only have instability (but have all 16GiB of RAM), but also some that have both problems.

We have one 1072 still in production that always shows 12GiB, but like your 8GiB one is 100% stable.

So the RAM issue could be unrelated to the instability issue. It does not surprise me, though, when we run into ones reporting less than 16GiB that are also completely unstable. The RAM count issue makes it obvious that there is a hardware fault. Given that there is one hardware fault that is clearly obvious, it is not surprising that perhaps a particular device might have more than one fault. My guess is that these particular models are tricky to manufacture reliably for some reason. Don't know if it is a problem at the fab that produces the TILE-Gx72 SoCs, or a problem with mainboard manufacture or assembly.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:08 am

i think for the time tile TILE-Gx72 Processor was announced (almost 10 years ago) 72 core count was pushing the limits, even today looks like for a General Purpose CPU scaling towards such high ammount of cores into a monolytic chip falls in to diminishing returns and technical difficulties, in fact looks like Tilera was trying to achieve the 100 core count at 1.5ghz but had to cut to 72 cores and 1.200mhz but on ccr1072 only 1.000mhz, maybe It would have been better to stick with lower count of 64 cores but higher clock, who knows...

for example o dont know if Tilera was even able to get the TILE-Gx72 to run at 1.200 mhz stable, one downfall of ccr1072 was a reduced core clock of 1.000mhz in comparison with ccr1036, 1016 and 1009 running at 1.200mhz, leaving performance of flagship 1072 behind their smaller brothers in some scenarios

PD (i am aware GPU and TPU scale far better in ammount of cores than a general purpose CPU)
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:11 pm

The 1072 was probably a bit on the bleeding edge of reasonable hardware design.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:24 pm

If true, still not an excuse for poor post-sale support. If you are going to put it on the market, then you need to be prepared to support it, which includes fixing the broken ones.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Mon Dec 26, 2022 5:20 pm

We have found that identical IP addresses or MAC numbers on the network (192.168.88.1/24) causes such reboots on Mikrotik routers. Example: 2 switches and on switch 2 backup of switch 1 is loaded, then you have such reboots. With RouterOS 7.6 this even leads to kernel crashes (only same IP, MAC makes no difference). Likewise RouterOS 7.6 does not tolerate devices with RouterOS 6.x in the neighborhood.

We have 3 CCR1072 and have been routing traffic over them for 5 years. We never had a failure as long as the IP addresses of the devices were set differently and the same software version was used on all devices.

RouterOS 7.6 on a CCR1072 massively reduces CPU usage compared to 6.x
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:27 pm

The only way to fix the random reboots is to completely turn-off the Connection Tracking.
If the connection tracking is on and there is a slight traffic jump, it will reboot.
We have several CCR1072s and turning off connection tracking fixed the reboot issue on all of them.

Use them for plain routing and thats it.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Mon Apr 17, 2023 8:23 pm

Anybody replace the CCR1072 with the CCR2116 and find it to be more stable?

We need to decide if this is just a tile issue and replace our CCR1072's or a mikrotik issue, and switch to another vendor. Right now we are doing pppoe, but are looking at moving to dhcp to serve customers even though it's more difficult to track usage without a convenient virtual interface.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Mon Apr 17, 2023 8:30 pm

if you have an issue with ccr1072, changing it for ccr2116/2216 will not resolve it
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Thu Oct 05, 2023 4:16 am

I realise this thread is a few months old but @chechito you are talking nonsense. It is flawed hardware, nothing to do with implementation. Sorry, you are giving bad advice. Yes I have had success replacing 1072s with 2116 routers. Tile is a joke.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Nov 14, 2023 12:48 am

troubleshooting a performance problem with a customer's 1072 that only occurs when traffic is above ~450 Mbps, I came across this thread, and thought to check the RAM, and yup 11.8 GiB of reported ram...

already working with support on the issue with an active ticket, and going to add this info to the ticket.
 
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Re: RouterOS v7.6 in CCR1072

Tue Nov 14, 2023 6:24 am

Mikrotik please don't be afraid!

clearly explain the root cause of the problem with this hardware

What happens when Statefull is running is that it has a watchdog problem in case of instant high connection traffic.
Since you haven't been able to figure this out for 5 years, you know it's a definite problem.

Why exactly have you never explained this?

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