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jerryroy1
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2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Wed Apr 05, 2023 10:49 pm

Hello,

I am looking for a 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings so we do not have to trench and run fiber. Can anyone recommend a solution? Preferably Mikrotik if available. The closest thing I think that can reach minimum 2 gig bandwidth is a netmetal unit.

Thanks in advance

JR
 
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Thu Apr 06, 2023 2:56 am

60GHz will be ideal for this use case, but sadly Mikrotik STILL doesn't have a single 60GHz product with SFP+ slot or faster than 1GbE ports. So even if radio rate could do ~5Gbps, there are no ports to actually fully utilize the bandwidth. For a few gigabits, you can perhaps use multiple wAPs bonded together, but number of channels is limited and it just sucks wasting all that radio bandwidth for just 1Gbit/s link... so other option is to look at the competition as they have pricey but real radio with SFP+ slot that will give you the wanted bandwidth with just a single link.
As for the suggested Netmetal, even the fastest one with 3 chains of 802.11ac will have radio rate of ~1300Mbit/s but actual link data rate will be half of that due to overhead. And remember that's also just half-duplex channel, so maybe you may get 600-700Mbit/s half-duplex from single link... hopefully running at max MCS level 24/7... just no. 60GHz is only real viable option here for fast link.
 
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Ca6ko
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Thu Apr 06, 2023 9:55 am

Wireless connections at these speeds will come out very expensive.
It is cheaper, more reliable, more convenient, more practical to lay an optical cable.
 
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Thu Apr 06, 2023 11:13 am

I can suggest Ceragon devices.
It is not a MikroTik competitor becase MikroTik do not realize point-to-point links on licensed bands.

Obviously is more expensive than lay a fiber, as @Ca6ko wrote.

If you try to use MikroTik product, you can use one RB5009UPr+S+OUT with 4 Cube 60Pro ac (all for each side).
($319 x 2) + ($149 x 8) = $1830 for 4Gbps link.

The cost of Fiber is ridiculous in comparison...
But I do not think that trench and run fiber cost less of $1830....
 
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Thu Apr 06, 2023 11:32 pm

Well, using LACP with combined 4x 1 Gbit/s:

[switch in building A, port 1, LACP] ----[MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]--------layer 3 -------- [MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]----[switch in building B, port 1 with LACP]

[switch in building A, port 2, LACP] ----[MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]--------layer 3 -------- [MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]----[switch in building B, port 2 with LACP]

[switch in building A, port 3, LACP] ----[MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]--------layer 3 -------- [MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]----[switch in building B, port 3 with LACP]

[switch in building A, port 4, LACP] ----[MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]--------layer 3 -------- [MikroTik router with EoIP endpoint]----[switch in building B, port 4 with LACP]
 
r00t
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Thu Apr 06, 2023 11:55 pm

Also with 60GHz it might be possible to reuse the frequencies if you possibly can locate links in such way that they can't see each other. For example let's imagine two office buildings say 10 floors high. If you put one 4xlink on the roof, sitting just a bit above the roof floor, it will not see the lower floor windows at all. So you could have another 4x link say at 2nd floor level. Radios on the roof will not be able to see any of the lower ones, not even reflections and vice versa...
But yeah, with so many radios and effort to put it all together and get it working, getting ONE proper MW link, even if more expensive, might be better option. Also look for some laser/optical links, for very short hops they might be cheaper option.
 
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sirbryan
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Fri Apr 07, 2023 4:41 pm

I am looking for a 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings so we do not have to trench and run fiber.
Ubiquiti has several 60GHz options.
  • AF60HD - 2-3Gbps aggregate up to 6Gbps aggregate (3Gbps each way "full duplex") ~ $360 apiece (your best option if you can find them in stock; I might be able to part with a pair of my stock--PM me)
  • AF60XG - Same as AF60HD, just larger dish and $1000 apiece. Overkill for 50 meters.
  • AF60XR - Also $1000 apiece, but only 2.7Gbps aggregate (presently). Also overkill for 50 meters, but in stock on Ubiquiti's store.
All have SFP+ ports.


Tachyon Networks also has a 60GHz option.
  • Their 301 radios have a 120° spread
  • The 302 radios have a 40° spread
  • Both can be AP or CPE, and both cost $250 each.
They have a 2.5Gbps POE-in port and a 1Gbps POE-out port, and on the bench I've gotten 1.6Gbps of throughput. Others have gotten up to 2Gbps. I'd consider this your second best option, and WAV has them in stock.


Siklu & Aviat both make 2, 5, and 10Gbps 80GHz radios that would work. They can be had for around US$6000 with 1ft antennas and 10Gbps licenses.
Used 2Gbps radios can be found for $3000 a pair.
70/80GHz is lightly licensed in the US. Not sure about other countries. Full duplex, 250microsecond latency (less than fiber, especially at greater distances).

Otherwise, as mentioned by others, you'd need to bond multiple MikroTik radios together to get multi-gig.
 
marcin21
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Mon Apr 17, 2023 4:53 pm

@Mikrotik staff, have You considered 60ghz device with at least 2,5Gbps+ ethernet port or sfp+ ?

its crazy that we have soho routers hap -ax with 2,5gig which is rather impossible to saturate, and in the other hand we have 60ghz ptp solution that is capable of 1,8gbps traffic since it was introduced, and still limited with 1Gbps ethernet. :(

or maybe there is a solution with half size channels 1080mhz instead of 2160, so we could use parellel links to do the trick?
 
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Mon Apr 17, 2023 6:09 pm

Or MikroTik could develop a new product using the same Peraso chip as Tachyon and Ubiquiti, but with RouterOS under the hood. Each endpoint could be routed if you wanted, which would work very nicely for PTMP backhaul. With an LHG version for CPE, they could go a bit further than Tachyon and yet utilize the same sub-per-AP count (32) that Ubiquiti has yet to figure out (15) (the greater range of Wave impacts the scheduling).

Under the covers, the Peraso radio board usually connects to the host computer via USB3. MikroTik could easily create a low-cost USB CPE that works with the outdoor RB5009, creating a great combination for relay sites.
 
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Re: 2 gig to 10 gig wireless link for short distances (50 meters) between buildings

Mon Apr 17, 2023 6:47 pm

Yeah, it's rather annoying there is not a single 60GHz product with SFP+ from Mikrotik... really... come on... 60GHz products were released 5 years ago...
Yet they keep releasing more and more outdoor switches with SFPs, even CRS504-4XQ-OUT now with 100GbE you can put on your roof... but no radios to plug into anything like that.
Also where is the Terragraph ?!! It's been completely memoryholed by now, there is not a single note about it anywhere on the Mikrotik website, not even in list of contents for all newsletters, yet it was the hottest thing like 2 years ago, revolutionary future of WISPs. What happened with all these trials? That hardware was supposed to have SFP+ slot. *poof* ... and it's gone, forgotten ...

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