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YordanY1
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How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:30 pm

Hello.
I have 3 buildings to bridge wirelessly, and they all receive their IP's from a single router ( all devices is Mikrotiks )
So I were thinking is these omnidirectional MIMO devices OmniTIK (Mikrotik OmniTIK U-5HnD) is capable of making such bridge, but honestly I have never worked with them, and I have no clue how to create such bridge.
Please guide me if it is possible.
Here my network diagram which I would like to achieve.
Image
Omnitik
 
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mkx
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:23 pm

I can see two (potential) problems:
  1. 100 metres is far for devices with omnidirectional antennae. You would achieve a much better (more stable and faster) link if using devices with directional antennae
  2. node in lower left part of ypur diagram ... connecting to both router node and to child node. Single device can either be AP (serving multiple clients) or client (connecting to single AP). It is possible to configure device to be client to single AP and to be AP at the same time, but that means many constrains. Resulting network has reduced capacity.
    Which means it's mostly better to use two wireless devices in such case, each serving its own link.
 
YordanY1
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:53 pm

even 50 mbit will be fine, or you mean that I will not be able to get even 50 mbits on the 2nd and 3rd network ?
 
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mkx
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:18 pm

In short: reaching your goal (50Mbps) will be hard.

omniTIK is a 802.11 a/n device operating on 5GHz. High band means shorter range athough relatively high gain antennae help somehow. Realistically it is possible to reach up to 1/2 of theoretical throughput (300 Mbps for omnitik) in next to ideal radio conditions (no external interference, short to medium range between devices, etc.).
If single node serves as a hop (as is lower left node on your diagram), then same packet from left to right flies twice over the air, consumes twice the airtime. Further if not all devices in the mesh can hear each other, possibility for collisions increases (search for "hidden station problem").

All the mentioned problems mean that realistic throughput of such a mesh could be as low as one tenth of theoretical maximum. If one uses dedicated devices per link and assuming 5GHz band is used, it is possible to build a series of independent point to point links which will each run to its maximum speed (probably 100Mbps or higher real throughput). Or go for ultimate performance with 60 GHz family of products.
 
ivicask
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 12:13 am

Buy 6x sxt Sq 5ghz models(for 50mbit even none ac ones will be enough) but I recommend ac models for futureproof and put one at each of the arrows from Pic and all will work perfect fine even at much greater distance.
 
mducharme
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 2:36 am

If you have line of sight, you can do 60ghz PTMP, with an AP at one site and subscriber radios at the other three sites.
 
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anav
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:42 am

1. LOS basic requirement
2. Classic pt to Multipoint scenario
3. 60HZ no brainer
4. Bridging is a bad idea in general (desperate final solution if nothing else better can be done)

Base station by router (useful up to 200m)
https://mikrotik.com/product/wap_60gx3_ap

Building Units
https://mikrotik.com/product/wap_60g_ap

Seeing as the longest length of such a design is 50m,
Even a decent pt to multipoint 2.4ghz/ 5ghz setup will work well
I do note the mantbox is a sector antenna but 120 degrees vice 180 degrees by the wap-60gx3

And from the diagram the coverage looks to be clearly greater than 120 and a bit less than 180.
 
YordanY1
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:14 am

:'( Seems like digging for cables will be going again.. How I hate this part when it comes to this.. :'(
Thank You guys ! You've saved me a few hundred bucks spend on the void.
 
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:39 am

Seems like digging for cables will be going again.. How I hate this part when it comes to this..

That 100-metre distance calls for fibre cables. And doit in "star" topology.

Any you'll be glad to lay cables later. Fibre cables are only future proof solution (if you're going for future-proof solution, go for single mode fibre).
 
YordanY1
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:49 am

Seems like digging for cables will be going again.. How I hate this part when it comes to this..

That 100-metre distance calls for fibre cables. And doit in "star" topology.

Any you'll be glad to lay cables later. Fibre cables are only future proof solution (if you're going for future-proof solution, go for single mode fibre).
well.. It's going to be actually about 1800 meters digging, and 3600+ meters fiber installation because of the topology of the buildings, and this I was trying to avoid.. but well..
 
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 8:00 pm

Seems like digging for cables will be going again.. How I hate this part when it comes to this..

That 100-metre distance calls for fibre cables. And doit in "star" topology.

Any you'll be glad to lay cables later. Fibre cables are only future proof solution (if you're going for future-proof solution, go for single mode fibre).
MKX, why single mode for distances less than 300m (now that we know its greater yes makes sense but for 50-100 metres why not Multi mode)
 
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mkx
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 8:29 pm




That 100-metre distance calls for fibre cables. And doit in "star" topology.

Any you'll be glad to lay cables later. Fibre cables are only future proof solution (if you're going for future-proof solution, go for single mode fibre).
MKX, why single mode for distances less than 300m (now that we know its greater yes makes sense but for 50-100 metres why not Multi mode)

Single mode allows different uses of xWDM: BiDi (single strand for both directions) or CWDM/DWDM for allowing higher throughput. Allows also to patch through WAN optics (which is always done using SM cables).
The only drawback is slightly higher price of SFP modules (in order of a few bucks per plain 1310nm module vs. 850nm MM module).
 
YordanY1
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:37 pm

Well. I will probably go for single mode with 1 fiber. They offer me some Umbiquiti devices - Ubiquiti Networks LAP-120 + 4 receivers Ubiquiti NanoStation M5 as well.
At this point I am not sure anymore what to do.
 
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Mon Nov 15, 2021 11:47 pm

The reason I ask is I will be ordering some OM3 for a 270 foot cable from the house to a potential future shed.
Sounds like SM is better suited for main connection to the house, where I only need internet for a local AP etc, nothing fancy.
 
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mkx
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Tue Nov 16, 2021 9:20 am

SM is better suited for everything. MM was intended for data centre installations because at the beginning of silicon era SM fibres were quite expensive due to more difficult manufacturing process (MM cables have thicker glass core which means dimension and purity tolerances are wider) while MM cables' shorter range wasn't a problem.

Bu then, I'm pretty sure you'll do as you please :wink:
 
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Tue Nov 16, 2021 9:23 am

Well. I will probably go for single mode with 1 fiber.

If I was installing cable between buildings, I would most certainly go for SM cable with multiple strands (at least 8 ). And lay it inside a pipe (with diameter of at least an inch) so it is possible to pull cable out and replace it with another cable with more fibre strands.
Cable price is low compared to price of trench digging and, as I said, it's good to be future proof. The xWDM / BiDi stuff comes when dark strands are not available any more.
 
YordanY1
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Re: How to bridge 3 buildings wirelessly

Tue Nov 16, 2021 1:28 pm

Yep. digging it is :'(

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