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ivicask
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sun May 14, 2017 9:21 pm

Just wanted to say for everyone asking for roaming implementation like Ubiquiti has, did anyone actually tried it so far? I have several of this UniFI APs at one customer, and i tried zero hand off feature and made everything so much worse and unstable that i had to turn it off, it simple doesn't work as good as you would expect it..
 
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nz_monkey
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon May 15, 2017 8:36 am

Just wanted to say for everyone asking for roaming implementation like Ubiquiti has, did anyone actually tried it so far? I have several of this UniFI APs at one customer, and i tried zero hand off feature and made everything so much worse and unstable that i had to turn it off, it simple doesn't work as good as you would expect it..
Ubiquiti's "Zero Handoff" feature is different from what people here are asking for. It is effectively a "single channel" system like Meru/wiNG. Even Ubiquiti do not recommend it!

What people here are asking for is an equivalent to Ubiquiti's Fast-Roaming https://help.ubnt.com/hc/en-us/articles/115004662107
http://thebrotherswisp.com/ | Mikrotik MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCINE | Fortinet FTCNA, FCNSP, FCT | Extreme Networks ENA
 
ivicask
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon May 15, 2017 9:59 am

Just wanted to say for everyone asking for roaming implementation like Ubiquiti has, did anyone actually tried it so far? I have several of this UniFI APs at one customer, and i tried zero hand off feature and made everything so much worse and unstable that i had to turn it off, it simple doesn't work as good as you would expect it..
Ubiquiti's "Zero Handoff" feature is different from what people here are asking for. It is effectively a "single channel" system like Meru/wiNG. Even Ubiquiti do not recommend it!

What people here are asking for is an equivalent to Ubiquiti's Fast-Roaming https://help.ubnt.com/hc/en-us/articles/115004662107
Well yea its brand new thing introduced this year, i was just saying about zero handoff which was originally requested prior to 2017, im sure mikrotik will give us something similar to FastRoaming soon(i hope)
 
publicmail
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:11 pm

+1
I use mikrotik at home. And even I really need roaming support. Capsman ACL workarond works really terrible: it disconnects when I do not need it, and vice versa. Without ACL workaround clients dont switch APs when they should.

Some people argued here that this is client responsibility to swith AP. Yes, it is. But client logic relies on AP supported standards, like 802.11r/k.

So, I am waiting for substantial roaming implementation in Mikrotik. Otherwise entire Capsman development is just a waste.
 
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juliokato
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sun Jul 30, 2017 8:54 pm

+1
Why the Mikrotik not has the feature too?
incredible how late it is.
I apologize my grammatical errors, my english not so good, I am not a native speaker.
Wiki is maintained in English. I use Google translator. 8)
 
andriys
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:15 pm

Some people argued here that this is client responsibility to swith AP. Yes, it is. But client logic relies on AP supported standards, like 802.11r/k.
Those standards are relatively recent/new and the number of client devices that are actually capable of using those is greatly exaggerated. Also they still do not allow the AP to dictate the client when and where to roam- that still is totally client's decision. The standards you are referring to just (potentially) make the roaming process faster/more efficient. But please note that clients that support (and can benefit from the use of) these standards are likely to be rather good roamers even on their own (i.e. without AP assistance).

What I'm trying to say is- do not expect any magic to happen once 802.11r and 802.11k are finally implemented (if ever). The 802.11r is believed to make a huge difference in the networks using WPA Enterprise. When using WPA Personal, however, the difference is usually hardly noticeable. Also take into account that enabling 802.11r usually breaks compatibility with the older clients that do not support 802.11r so you may end up living with two separate SSIDs- one for newer clients with 802.11r enables, and another one for older clients with 802.11r disabled.
Without ACL workaround clients dont switch APs when they should.
Try reducing the tx-power of your APs? That helps, really helps.
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:46 am

Try reducing the tx-power of your APs? That helps, really helps.
Sounds reasonable. I will definitely try. As I suppose AP Tx power should correlate with clients Tx power.
Would you recommended Tx power for me (I am a home user: iphone, android, laptops etc) for channels 1, 6, 11 and for 5G?
Thank you very much :)
Also they still do not allow the AP to dictate the client when and where to roam- that still is totally client's decision.
In my opinion only client should decide when it should roam. Not AP. Thats why I do not like ACL workaround, as I described in my first post.
But client logic depends on AP supported standards, signal strength, etc. We dont know, but we could discover clients behaviour via experiments. For example: https://habrahabr.ru/post/312948/
Those standards are relatively recent/new and the number of client devices that are actually capable of using those is greatly exaggerated.
Look around. What does people really want? Whey want to use WhatsApp/Viber/Skype/etc voice/video calls. They use iphone/ipad/android with latest firmware. Vast majority of these devices do support these standards (https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT202628)

Even if implementation of these standards wont improve wifi roaming (as you described), I believe that Mikrotik SHOULD implement them in sake of marketing.
Really, people read articles, people use google, people consciously choose hardware for their SOHO wifi networks. And they definitely take into account 802.11r/k/etc standards.
So, without these standards entire Capsman development looks like a waste. Really.

For example OpenWRT supports 802.11r. I can not understand why this is a problem for Mikrotik.
 
andriys
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:37 pm

Would you recommended Tx power for me (I am a home user: iphone, android, laptops etc) for channels 1, 6, 11 and for 5G?
I'm getting rather good results with 50mW output power, which means setting tx-power to 15dBm for 802.11ac-capable interfaces (where tx-power means total power) and 12dBm for double-chain (10dBm for triple-chain) non-802.11ac-capable interfaces (where tx-power means power per chain). You may also consider decreasing the tx-power for 2.4GHz interfaces even further to give 5GHz band some priority.
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Tue Oct 03, 2017 11:51 pm

I use edimax wap1750 with 11r and 11k. 11r gives a FT on my SSID decode data using WiFi analyser android application = [WPA2-PSK+FT/WPA2-CCMP][ESS]

All clients - android phones and tablets - connect and roam except 1 laptop with old Intel WiFi. 11n I think. In that case it connects but falls asleep and needs to reconnect periodically. Solution was a second SSID without 11r. The laptop functions with 11k enabled but I leave that off. Simple!

Roaming is smooth. But still a client decision. This means a client may not switch until out of range of a AP then a brief 1 or 2 second delay while it connects to a nearby AP. This happens if the client moves quickly away. And also occurs if moving back and forth between AP frequently. In this case, the android phone gets lazy. It appears that it's roaming, once done, won't happen again for about 2 minutes.

11r is broadcast. If it's unsupported then the client has issues. 11k must be requested by the client and so shouldn't matter in a mixed environment. AFAIK.

Long post I know.

Mikrotik. Get 11r and 11k on your APs NOW!
It's brilliant.
 
dave864
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:05 am

Any equipment you buy today will support 11r and 11k. Anything in the last 2 years will too. Almost all iPhones supported these standards for several years.

These standards are supported in all modern WiFi chipsets. It's up to vendors to implement on top.
 
achengit
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:45 pm

+++1, i hope MT have it (R K V)
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:14 pm

+++1
 
magneto
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:46 pm

+1
I would appriciate an official response on that important feature request from MikroTik team.
MikroTik team... are you there???
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:51 pm

They are too busy to answer.
Hope implementing 802.11r/k ;)
 
akant
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon Sep 10, 2018 8:18 am

+1 for 802.11r, 802.11k, 802.11v support with Mikrotik. The implementation of this is really table stakes now for any controller/enterprise wireless option to be considered seriously.


I am making a money decision today not to use Mikrotik based on the lack of this feature.
 
Mikhail73
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:18 am

+1.
 
muetzekoeln
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:15 pm

+1

plus "band steering" and "airtime fairness".

Please, it's about time!
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Oct 17, 2018 3:27 pm

It would be nice in the meantime to have guidelines to optimize roaming with Capsman.
 
krempel
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:01 pm

Till now i was rather pleased with the mikrotik routerboards, but right now here in germany the switch to voip is in progress, so my customers ask for WLAN-roaming, avoiding dual HP with simultanous DECT.
A lot of "better" smartphones come with the 802.11 r,k,v protocols for that, so my last two projects i dismounted the routerboard devices and substituted them with grandstream. Now, the handover runs much smoother. sorry for my lousy english, german is my mother - lang :-)

Andreas Kemper
 
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Fri Nov 30, 2018 1:28 pm

Today, I lost my project to implement Wifi network for 100 access points due to the fact that Mikrotik does not support 802.11r/k.
 
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erebusodora
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Thu Dec 13, 2018 7:21 pm

The project requirements for WiFi4EU are:

-supporting 2,4Ghz – 5Ghz ( same time)

-support IEEE 802.1x

support 802.11ac Wave I

support IEEE 802.11r

support IEEE 802.11k

support IEEE 802.11v

support 2x2 MIMO

support Hotspot 2.0

For Bulgaria only, vouchers earned EUR 1 695 000. But unfortunately Microtik does not meet the requirements. All my colleagues want and want to work with Mikrotik but unfortunately Microtik does not meet the requirements. Microtik It's time to wake up because other companies are ahead!
 
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karlisi
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:19 am

The project requirements for WiFi4EU are:
(..)
support IEEE 802.11r
(..)
But unfortunately Microtik does not meet the requirements.
We also wanted to participate in this project to extend our infrastructure. It seems, EU money will go to another company. Perhaps Mikrotik don't need this money?
---
Karlis
 
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erebusodora
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:29 am

The project requirements for WiFi4EU are:
(..)
support IEEE 802.11r
(..)
But unfortunately Microtik does not meet the requirements.
We also wanted to participate in this project to extend our infrastructure. It seems, EU money will go to another company. Perhaps Mikrotik don't need this money?
For Germany, Italy, Romania,France, Spain, the funds allocated for project WiFi4EU is 20 160 000 EURO. Mikrotik lost that money because they dont need this money. Another company example: ub*** ,cis***** etc. cover all requirements. MIkrotik why not wake up ?
 
mistry7
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:38 pm

The project requirements for WiFi4EU are:
(..)
support IEEE 802.11r
(..)
But unfortunately Microtik does not meet the requirements.
We also wanted to participate in this project to extend our infrastructure. It seems, EU money will go to another company. Perhaps Mikrotik don't need this money?
For Germany, Italy, Romania,France, Spain, the funds allocated for project WiFi4EU is 20 160 000 EURO. Mikrotik lost that money because they dont need this money. Another company example: ub*** ,cis***** etc. cover all requirements. MIkrotik why not wake up ?
Mikrotik is on Wireless one way road with old legacy kernel and own wireless driver with mostly basic hardware support....
 
eduardomazolini
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:31 am

++1
 
muetzekoeln
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:53 am

Since lately there is some developement in ROS6 features regarding long awaited features, I would like to bump this ones:

- dot11k/r/v based roaming / AP steering in CAPsManager
- dot11k/r/v based band steering (also without CAPsManager)
- option for airtime fairness

Also from other threads:
- support of wave2 (MU-MIMO, beamforming); viewtopic.php?t=145047
- tunable DTIM and beacon interval; viewtopic.php?t=116221
- stop broadcasting device model and ROS version with the beacon; viewtopic.php?t=133186
- support dot11d including country code; viewtopic.php?t=72840; viewtopic.php?t=144151
Last edited by muetzekoeln on Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:05 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
Alfa80
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:22 am

Since lately there is some developement in ROS6 features regarding long awaited features, I would like to bump this one.

- dot11k/r/v based roaming / AP steering in CAPsManager
- dot11k/r/v based band steering (also without CAPsManager)
- option for airtime fairness

Also from other threads:
- support of wave2 (MU-MIMO, beamforming); viewtopic.php?t=145047
- tunable DTIM and beacon interval; viewtopic.php?t=116221
- stop broadcasting device model and ROS version with the beacon; viewtopic.php?t=133186
- support dot11d including country code; viewtopic.php?t=72840; viewtopic.php?t=144151
Great news! In which version of ROS6? Is that only announcement of the development or some builds are available as of now?
 
muetzekoeln
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:04 am

Great news! In which version of ROS6? Is that only announcement of the development or some builds are available as of now?

Don't get me wrong! I was hopeful when dot1x and ike2 features were released in 6.45beta, that developement of often reqested features was sped up. So I brought up my favorites to give them some attention.
 
Alfa80
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Sat Jun 22, 2019 12:55 pm

Don't get me wrong! I was hopeful when dot1x and ike2 features were released in 6.45beta, that developement of often reqested features was sped up. So I brought up my favorites to give them some attention.
Oh I see now. A hastily & hopeful interpretation of that by me, to the point that I upgraded multiple devices to v6.45.b62!!. So still waiting and hoping....at least some more attention might be drawn here reincarnating this wish list....
 
Xenhat
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Re: Feature request: CAPsManager - roaming

Mon Jul 29, 2019 8:36 am

Reached this topic while looking for a solution to flaky roaming for Apple,Android, Microsoft and Linux-based devices in my house that relies on two Mikrotik RB's to achieve full-building coverage (linked by a RJ-45 cable).

I hope some form of technology can be engineered to help, if not fix this issue.
I understand that roaming is a client decision, but any way to hint the client that the closest/faster antenna is a better choice would be appreciated.

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