Backhaul Design

Hello everbody!

Im trying to find out if the following aproach (view the graphic also!) is realistic (technically!):

i have 200 schools, some in cities, some in rural zones, i want to interconnect each school to an central location where i have an digital library, an asterisk central (each school will get almost 1 extension..) and where i have located the central access to internet (2 x 25Mb/s)

total aggregate Troughput based on CIR of 512Kb and Burst up to 3Mb/s is
200 x 512kb/s x 2 =208Mb/s up to
200 x 3Mb/s x 2 = 1200Mb/s (i think this is a good limit on CPE :smiley: )

The central location (Central) is geographically in the center …
the first hop from Central to a TOWER1 in adecuate montain is about 8km (1.Hop Central-TOWER1 PtP 8km, Hardware Dragonwave Horizon DUO or DragonWave Quantum in unlicenced 24Ghz, or is the an product from mt that can handle the trougput?)
from here i want to reach the diferent schools in maximum 4 more hops (Tower1-Tower2a PtP 50km), (Tower2a, Tower3a PtP 40km), (Tower3a-Tower4a PTP40km), (Tower4a-CPE PTP 15-30km) all in unlicenced 5,4-5,7Ghz

On each of the towers Tower2a, Tower3a, Tower4a should be installed also an MT PTMP AP for also connecting Schools (MT CPE) in correspond range (up to 15km)

From TOWER1 i have to repeat this backhaul construction about 6 times in diferent geogaphically directions to reach all scools. and to reduce the troughput on each string(?) to about maximum 150Mb/s

So im talking of a construct with almost 15-20 Towers, almost every Tower has installed 2-3 PTP Backhaul connections and 1 PTMP Base Station for connection to School CPE.

The bottlenecks are obviosly:

the PTP fom Central to Tower1 (about 200Mb/s-1200Mb/s with almost 6-8 routes!?)

And the 2. HOP that is TOWER1 to Tower2a-e with almost 30-180Mb/s

after reading some topics in this 2 first steps i think i have no alternative and must choose Dragonwave an Motorola equipment (almost for stability in heavy RF Area) Tower3-4 are decentralized and i am not especting strong RF interference… here i want to use MT equipment.

I want to monitor each tower, so i am planning to install on each tower an MT Router (dedicated or using an adecuate product that also can handle the PtMP construct!), thats beacause i want to monitor the status of all towers with one tool (obviosly i will use another tool to monitor in detail Dragonwave and Moto.. equipment)

Cant afford the cost for licenced-frequency but have enough budget for 1 Dragonwave PTP 1200mb/s Link, 6 Moto 58600 PTP 300mb links, and all other stuff including 40m autosoported Tower. (other stuff means about 20 ptp backhaul links with maybe RB600, 20PTMP BASES also with RB600 or RB433AH, 200CPE maybe RB433AH, and finally if necesario another 20 rb600 for routing and monitoring each tower interconnect, of course also 200 29dbi Grid Antennas, some 29 to 32dbi dual polarized parabolic antennas for backhaul, and some panel antenas for PtMP AP)

Other info:

All shools will get 1 private subnet, an 1 Public IP. Normaly each PC on school has to reach only services in Central location!! To reach servers located in a school is necesary the use of the public IP of this shool. Im getting from the ISP an IPs in an public C subnet range.


So here my questions:

1)Any questions from potential helpers??
2)What kind of routing should i use?
3)What kind of MT equipment should i use on Tower[2-4],[a-f]
4)What routerboard should i use for CPE no shools? 1-20 simultaneus active users in private subnet + 1 Public IP?
5)Should i use an dedicated MT router on each tower or can i a MT router handle multiple links(almost 2 PTP Backhaul connections and up an PTMP Base Station for about 15-20 CPE)
6) I know about problems caused by MOTO equipment, what should i do to avoid interference with my own moto backhaul?
7) Im trying to offer VOIP over this construct…can i espect this will work, latency could be a problem because of up to 5 hops to asterisk, and another 5 hops to the endpoint?

Well i hope to get some feedback and a lot of good ideas, to see how can i reach my approach… expected timeline is to be productive in may 2010…


a lot of thanks for assisting…

Regards
ulaaser
wifi backhaul.gif

Why do you plan to use PTP600? They are expensive (may be your pricing is better??).
It’s cheaper to use licensed frequency equipment. PTP600 eats 50W per device.
Frequency licenses are cheaper here.

I would use OSPF for routing. It works very stable.

I would use DualPol-Antennes (Mars/MTI) with compartment and RB411AH
for PTP-Connections. This avoids coax-runs and you can use them with R5H or R52N.
Avoid doing 2 PTP Connections with one board. Performance is lower.

RB411 is good for CPE.

Licensed Frequency Equipment gives lower latency. No interference and a free channel
in each direction. So you get <1ms per hop. Where you cant afford it use MT.
If frequency/mounting space is free use Dual-Nstreme.

Stefan

ok up to this time i dont have evaluated licenced frequency because i dont know price structure..specially in my country… how is mecanism in usa? Must i get frequency for each PTP connection? is the payment monthly, yearly, how much usually?

I have found an interesting video what confirms your recomendation.. using following combination to realize highspeed backhaul ptp link:

On each site:
1 x RB1000
4 x RB433xx
4 x Ubiquiti 600mW XR5
2 x Dual Polarized Antennas

Configuring Bonding (4 Links bonded =>more troughput) and N-Streaming (higher troughput on each link and less interference) all this in theory!!!

So what i need to know is how much real TCP troughput i can expect for such a link using 34dbi dual polarised antennas over a distance of 30km and over 50 km?!! Or saying it in other manner, i need to get 200-250mb aggregate troughput over 50km, what equipment should i use?

PTP 600 is your only choice or a few (like 4 or 5) Nstreme2 links bonded together. 802.11n might be another solution but not stable right now.

Ok and now focusing on the Tower1: What router should i use to connect the primary backbone PTP link (Dragonwave coming from Center, with about 200Mb/s-1200Mb/s aggregate Troughput to the 6-8 ptp links each one with aggregate troughput of 35Mb/s-150Mb/s?

Knows somebody a way to connect a mini-pci Gigabit card to the RB493AH? Physically it seems to be possible , but im not sure in what manner the mini-pci is interconnected on the board.. is here a trougput of about 80MB/s posible??? This combination would result in a powerful router with one gigabit port and 9 Ethernet ports. But im not sure if the RB493 is the right choice …maybe i should use here better an solution from Cisco o 3COM?
INTEL minipci gigabit.JPG

I would use RB1000. Small, Fast and reliable. Other solution would be
a simple Gigabit switch.

Stefan